The first thing that was said in my InfoSec 101 class was that the best security is at the hardware level. If you really want to secure something, keep in inside a room with a lock, or chain it. Software will never be guaranteed security, and not having a camera cover is asking for something to go wrong, whether it's during a meeting or someone hacking into it.
Don't close your MacBook with a cover over the camera
711–720 of 990 posts
Re: Don't close your MacBook with a cover over the camera
#712This statement has a number of issues. First, you have to trust Apple that the indicator _really_ can't be disabled. You also have to trust that there isn't a vulnerability Apple is not aware about that could allow rolling the camera without the light coming on. This has happened in the past [0] and there are known Apple products that are vulnerable, yet the statement never mentions this making you believe it's impos…
i don’t understand the argument that you trust apple enough to use their os but not be enough to believe their green light
You have to use some operating system at the end of the day, and vulnerabilities can impact any of them. You might as well trust Apple as much as the next company, since all of them are liable for millions of lines of code, and it's likely they all presently have undiscovered vulnerabilities.
Re: Don't close your MacBook with a cover over the camera
#713Earlier quoted context omitted.
Tape? I bought 10 little plastic sliding cover things on Ali Express for <£2. Unless you're on a 100% China boycott (which I assume wouldn't permit a MacBook anyway) I don't see a reason not to use them. They're fine, permanent, had for 3 years and not fallen off or anything.
I use tape because it was already in my kitchen junk drawer and I literally never use the webcam on my laptop. It’s only a threat. The sliding covers are fine but it’s just more effort to order one.
Post It flags for me!
Re: Don't close your MacBook with a cover over the camera
#714Here’s the document explaining how it’s physically impossible to use the microphone when the MacBook lid is closed: https://support.apple.com/en-gb/guide/security/secbbd20b00b/... Where is the equivalent document explaining how it’s physically impossible for the camera to be active without the green LED lighting up?
AFAIK there's no official Apple document. Would you accept the recollection of an anonymous former Apple engineer writing to a fairly popular blog? /s https://daringfireball.net/2019/02/on_covering_webcams > All cameras after that one were different: The hardware team tied the LED to a hardware signal from the sensor: If the (I believe) vertical sync was active, the LED would light up. There is NO firmware control to…
What if the LED burns out? Is there any redundancy?
Re: Don't close your MacBook with a cover over the camera
#715This statement has a number of issues. First, you have to trust Apple that the indicator _really_ can't be disabled. You also have to trust that there isn't a vulnerability Apple is not aware about that could allow rolling the camera without the light coming on. This has happened in the past [0] and there are known Apple products that are vulnerable, yet the statement never mentions this making you believe it's impos…
> First, you have to trust Apple that the indicator _really_ can't be disabled. You also have to trust that there isn't a vulnerability Apple is not aware about that could allow rolling the camera without the light coming on.
I have made this point several times throughout this thread, so I apologize for repeating myself:
Every laptop Apple has manufactured in the last ten years has an LED connected to the same circuit which powers up the camera. You cannot send power to the camera without also sending power to the LED, which will in turn cause the LED to light up. Unless the LED is broken, in which case you will know because it will never light up.
If you manage to find a vulnerability in this system, I don't think I even mind, because you've also broken physics and very possibly found a way to generate unlimited electricity forever.
Re: Don't close your MacBook with a cover over the camera
#716This statement has a number of issues. First, you have to trust Apple that the indicator _really_ can't be disabled. You also have to trust that there isn't a vulnerability Apple is not aware about that could allow rolling the camera without the light coming on. This has happened in the past [0] and there are known Apple products that are vulnerable, yet the statement never mentions this making you believe it's impos…
Not to mention the CIA had an exploit for Samsung TVs that recorded audio even when the TV seems to be turned off[1]. It is better to have peace of mind by blocking the camera physically.
[1] https://www.zdnet.com/article/how-cia-mi5-hacked-your-smart-...
Re: Don't close your MacBook with a cover over the camera
#717This statement has a number of issues. First, you have to trust Apple that the indicator _really_ can't be disabled. You also have to trust that there isn't a vulnerability Apple is not aware about that could allow rolling the camera without the light coming on. This has happened in the past [0] and there are known Apple products that are vulnerable, yet the statement never mentions this making you believe it's impos…
i don’t understand the argument that you trust apple enough to use their os but not be enough to believe their green light
there are ways to get over other forms of trust, for example: use being pseudoanonymous. There is no way around video, unless you happen to wear a mask.
Re: Don't close your MacBook with a cover over the camera
#718This statement has a number of issues. First, you have to trust Apple that the indicator _really_ can't be disabled. You also have to trust that there isn't a vulnerability Apple is not aware about that could allow rolling the camera without the light coming on. This has happened in the past [0] and there are known Apple products that are vulnerable, yet the statement never mentions this making you believe it's impos…
> First, you have to trust Apple that the indicator _really_ can't be disabled. You also have to trust that there isn't a vulnerability Apple is not aware about that could allow rolling the camera without the light coming on. I have made this point several times throughout this thread, so I apologize for repeating myself: Every laptop Apple has manufactured in the last ten years has an LED connected to the same circu…
I trust you absolutely and toally on this. Why wouldn't I?
But if you had your entire net worth riding on it, would you trust yourself to be infallibly correct or would you trust something along the lines of a post-it note to be completely sure? You know, if your life depended on it on every single possible model of apple laptop in all circumstances imaginable? (Do we include if your laptop was interecepted and altered by a hostile agent? Because we know that happens too...)
Re: Don't close your MacBook with a cover over the camera
#719Earlier quoted context omitted.
Can you back this claim with references?
The other comment says there are dozens in this thread...I haven't seen anything specific mentioned. But, I remember reading something a year or two ago[1] that's not solidly sourced (it'd be great if Apple posted something on their website like they did about microphones [2]) > All cameras after that one were different: The hardware team tied the LED to a hardware signal from the sensor: If the (I believe) vertical…
And an Apple engineer also confirmed that Macs made in the last five years will ensure the LED flashes for at least 3 seconds, even for still photos.
Re: Don't close your MacBook with a cover over the camera
#720Earlier quoted context omitted.
AFAIK there's no official Apple document. Would you accept the recollection of an anonymous former Apple engineer writing to a fairly popular blog? /s https://daringfireball.net/2019/02/on_covering_webcams > All cameras after that one were different: The hardware team tied the LED to a hardware signal from the sensor: If the (I believe) vertical sync was active, the LED would light up. There is NO firmware control to…
What if the LED burns out? Is there any redundancy?
I'm not sure I follow. If the LED burns out you're implying the camera would no longer work? I imagine they'd replace the whole camera module. I saw one for an older model on ifixit for $30. I'd probably try and snag one scrap. I'm not sure how often it comes up.