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EU safety agency suspends Pakistani airlines' European authorisation

reuters.com

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Re: EU safety agency suspends Pakistani airlines' European authorisation

#141

Post by ClumsyPilot »

vageli wrote: post #127
ClumsyPilot wrote: post #109

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I dont think this nitpicking achieves anything, his overall point stands - we have hundreds of military jets and pilots with fuck all to do (fortunately). How many intercepts are there, one every few months? It makes no material difference against the backdrop of training and eqipment used in a regular business as usual.

> I dont think this nitpicking achieves anything, his overall point stands - we have hundreds of military jets and pilots with fuck all to do (fortunately). How many intercepts are there, one every few months? It makes no material difference against the backdrop of training and eqipment used in a regular business as usual. Maybe stores should stop hiring security guards in towns where the police don't have much to do…

This whole line of argument does not make sence - the whole debacle is about safety, not money.

Why do you believe the current training and safety regime is economically optimal? It is possible that having more cheaper airplanes and pilots that crash a little more often would be better for economy!

Re: EU safety agency suspends Pakistani airlines' European authorisation

#142

Post by ClumsyPilot »

dividedbyzero wrote: post #138
Bobbcatt wrote: post #113

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>I don't want to have PIA planes crashing into others or falling on my head. Even with sleeping pilots, you still are order of magnitude more likely to die by a car than by a plane.

I guess that's technically correct, but it seems a little pointless; with sufficient negligence, accidents are a virtual certainty, and those who come to harm in such an event would find little solace in that knowledge. In that sense, I don't want PIA planes falling on my own or anyone else's head, land, or property, anywhere in the world. There's no reason to allow pilots and airlines to behave like that, and lots o…

I think the real danger is to passengers of the plane. It is very rare for a plane crash to kill anyone on the ground.

Noth of earth surface is not cities, its water/farmland/etc

Re: EU safety agency suspends Pakistani airlines' European authorisation

#143

Post by addHocker »

trhway wrote: post #137
ClumsyPilot wrote: post #111

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well cosequences don't go away. Russia unified into a single state only because of the Mongoles, so you can blame Communism and cold war on them.

Russia was founded by Vikings. At about the same time Britain was massively raided and invaded by Vikings, and, across the Channel, Normandy (where Wilhelm the Conqueror is coming from) was established by Vikings. Those Vikings may have known each other or even been relatives. So, now we know whom to blame for the major part of the more than millennium of European history afterwards. Though Viking age was clearly res…

I blame africas savannah for homo sapiens, and thus m pro poaching. Thos lousy apex predators had it coming, for dozing off when we came along..

Re: EU safety agency suspends Pakistani airlines' European authorisation

#144

Post by PoachedSausage »

pycbr1 wrote: post #34
vinay427 wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think the OP was referring to Pakistan. More problematic in this respect are the UN accords that allow people from virtually any country to drive while visiting any other country, so you can have people from poorly licensed countries driving in a place where they're unfamiliar with the road system, language, etc. The EU/EEA reciprocity is due to EU regulations, not the assumption that every EU country has better dr…

I was indeed referring to Pakistan. A decade or so ago, you had to bribe a person or two in order to get your license at the dmv, and they made the actual driving test next to impossible to pass, something like "Make a reverse L shape without hitting any cones" the L being a very tight fit. If you didn't have a DL, you'd pay a bribe every time you were pulled over, although the bribes would be to the tune of $1, alth…

>"Make a reverse L shape without hitting any cones" the L being a very tight fit.

When I did my driving licence test in the UK that was one of the exercises. In my opinion, anyone without the hand-eye coordination and spatial awareness to reverse around a corner should stay away from operating ~1 ton heavy machinery.

Re: EU safety agency suspends Pakistani airlines' European authorisation

#145

Post by mannykannot »

sfjailbird wrote: post #45
thepangolino wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The fact that nearly a third of Pakistani pilots are known to have a fake license might have something to do with it. https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/nearly-a-third-of-pakis...

This was very overblown in the media. The issue was with re-certifications after changes to regulations in 2012, with most pilots (many with decades of experience) apparently preferring a bribe rather than cramming for months for the re-certification exam. Still bad but it's not just random people off the street flying 777s.

There is a reason why experience alone is not enough, and a big part is that serious emergencies are rare, so experience does not indicate preparedness.

Furthermore, an environment where bribery is common practice raises doubts about everything.

Re: EU safety agency suspends Pakistani airlines' European authorisation

#146

Post by bob1029 »

stock_toaster wrote: post #57
ohlookabird wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This seems to be the current list of rules for non EU countries and US states to transfer the driver's license to the German one after six months (linked by ADAC): https://res.cloudinary.com/adacde/image/upload/v1572337531/A... After having lived 5+ years in Virginia in the US and knowing multiple people that got their driver's license in Virginia, I am really surprised that apparently people with Virginia issued dri…

> After having lived 5+ years in Virginia in the US and knowing multiple people that got their driver's license in Virginia, I am really surprised that apparently people with Virginia issued driver's licenses don't need to do a theory nor a practice test in Germany to get the German license. Due to Langley being in VA maybe?

This was my first thought as well. It was probably more expedient from a diplomatic perspective to allow this, despite the obvious lack of rigorous training & testing.

Re: EU safety agency suspends Pakistani airlines' European authorisation

#147

Post by PoachedSausage »

swarnie_ wrote: post #30
Svip wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Germany restricts US driving licences depending on issuing US state. Denmark is apparently far more willing to let it slide, and anyone with a US driving licence can get it converted to a Danish one with just a doctor's approval. Although, in Denmark, their US licence is only valid for a month. But you don't have to retake the test. I am frankly a bit puzzled by this decision.

It seems fair, i grew up near a US air force base and the standard of driving was.... questionable. On the bright side if you do murder someone by driving on the wrong side of the road you can just catch a plane home and hide there, cant you Anne?

For reference:

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-northamptonshire-52630...

Re: EU safety agency suspends Pakistani airlines' European authorisation

#148

Post by mannykannot »

goodcanadian wrote: post #134
Erlich_Bachman wrote: post #133

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Aviate, Navigate, Communicate". https://pea.com/blog/posts/6-pilot-rules-that-everyone-shoul... This is an aviation rule that everyone lives by. There are many reasons for why that is the most sane and sensible approach to this problem, in addition to what is mentioned, the pilot's attention span is always under attack from various events that they have to correctly and swiftly respond to. This does not happen somet…

I understand your point, and it is entirely possible that the accident would have played out exactly as it did even if the ATC performance was impeccable. However, ATC performance was not impeccable. The preliminary report indicates they did not follow established procedures. In my opinion, because the aircraft did not follow the published approach, landing clearance should not have been given. They weren't even talk…

> If the pilots still attempted to land then it is on them.

It is on them regardless. ATC performed badly, and it blew one or two chances to say something that might have saved the day, but it was the pilots who actually caused the accident, through their own free choices of action - nothing that ATC did influenced their decision-making (quite the opposite, in fact.) ATC deserves criticism and blame, but it is different in kind to that which belongs to the pilots.

Re: EU safety agency suspends Pakistani airlines' European authorisation

#149

Post by rbrtdrmpc- »

Jdam wrote: post #60

If this doesn't apply to the UK as well, it is not enough. I would like to see a flyover ban as well, as PIA flies through the EU to the UK. I'm following the aviation industry closely and there are plenty of reports every now and then where PIA flights don't respond on radio anymore, triggering fighter intercepts. It is assumed that those pilots are oftentimes either sleeping or just don't bother because of their eg…

Not to sound too harsh, but I’m pretty sure many country would rather blast those planes with rockets than wait them to do any harm, just talking knowing how it works in my country, Italy, and all the counter rocket facility deployed on our borders. I’m just saying that because i have no info what’s the deal with other countries

Re: EU safety agency suspends Pakistani airlines' European authorisation

#150

Post by iso1210 »

ClumsyPilot wrote: post #142
dividedbyzero wrote: post #138

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I guess that's technically correct, but it seems a little pointless; with sufficient negligence, accidents are a virtual certainty, and those who come to harm in such an event would find little solace in that knowledge. In that sense, I don't want PIA planes falling on my own or anyone else's head, land, or property, anywhere in the world. There's no reason to allow pilots and airlines to behave like that, and lots o…

I think the real danger is to passengers of the plane. It is very rare for a plane crash to kill anyone on the ground. Noth of earth surface is not cities, its water/farmland/etc

More common than you'd think as most crashes are on takeoff or landing, which tend to be in more built up areas.
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