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MS will ban Forza players who add the confederate flag to their digital cars

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Re: MS will ban Forza players who add the confederate flag to their digital cars

#521

Post by VRay »

holler wrote: post #496
ApolloFortyNine wrote: post #420

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>I once ran a large online forum and set up a word filter to replace certain phrases with "fluffy bunnies" and other absurdities. It did a remarkable job of improving discourse once the foul-mouthed types realized their hateful messages were being massaged. Really? When I've seen this done, all that happens is you end up the 'approved' word. Everyone knows what it means though. So I guess if all you care about is the…

that doesn't mean everyone else knows though, and it at least detoxifies the conversation to observers

Hearthstone and some other online games only allow you to say a handful of positive messages to your opponents. Of course, what happened is that this somehow made interactions MORE toxic, since any time I say "Good game" or "Well played!" my opponent assumes I'm being sarcastic, and starts repeatedly blasting me with the same emote again and again.

Re: MS will ban Forza players who add the confederate flag to their digital cars

#522

Post by lopmotr »

jjjensen90 wrote: post #441
lopmotr wrote: post #413

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>perfectly reasonable for them to cut off your access to their service, as long as it's within the legal bounds of the ToS. I don't think companies should be directly regulated/penalized for banning users. I don't believe you really meant what you said there. Private companies aren't allowed to ban users because of their race. Do you want them to have that freedom and allow segregation? Or perhaps you only accept tha…

I realize you've made a weak straw man argument here, but there are important distinctions that need to be made in discussions about platform/user base moderation. While there are classes of people protected from discrimination by civil rights laws, what is not protected is discrimination or refusal of service for customers based on what they do rather than who they are . Banning someone for cheating, harassment, cir…

Sure. But Paulchap made a general statement without any of those distinctions. People often make such broad statements of belief when they're trying to make their position sound powerful and important but end up contradicting their actual beliefs. If you restrict it to a certain case or list a bunch of exceptions, it sounds less fundamental or important and makes it look more arbitrary. But that's more honest.

Most people's beliefs about right and wrong are arbitrary, not based on any fundamental principles, and there really isn't much of a defense for them other than "well, that just happens to be what I believe."

Re: MS will ban Forza players who add the confederate flag to their digital cars

#523

Post by sintaxi »

DaiPlusPlus wrote: post #475
shultays wrote: post #265

Interestingly hammer and sickle is not in the list

I think mainstream historians would argue that Soviet Communism was terrible - but it wasn't an ideology based on hate or subjugation. Displaying the Hammer and Sickle likely means you stand for unity with the working-class and seek an egalitarian society - or you have grievances with the current system of capitalism - and not that you hate on any particular group of people, and especially not for any of their immuta…

A distinction without a difference if in both cases the conclusion is democide.

Re: MS will ban Forza players who add the confederate flag to their digital cars

#524

Post by gamblor956 »

maxk42 wrote: post #244
JoshTko wrote: post #88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can create your own website and and host it yourself.

And yet we've seen hosts, domain registrars, and other service providers restrict certain ideas on their platforms. How practical is it in reality to be your own ISP, domain registrar, certificate authority, hosting service, web dev agency, and community moderator all in one?

Not very.

But it's what the Constitution provides. It guarantees you the right to express your thoughts using your own resources. It does not force others to do it or make it easier for you.

Re: MS will ban Forza players who add the confederate flag to their digital cars

#525

Post by BEEdwards »

holler wrote: post #496
ApolloFortyNine wrote: post #420

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>I once ran a large online forum and set up a word filter to replace certain phrases with "fluffy bunnies" and other absurdities. It did a remarkable job of improving discourse once the foul-mouthed types realized their hateful messages were being massaged. Really? When I've seen this done, all that happens is you end up the 'approved' word. Everyone knows what it means though. So I guess if all you care about is the…

that doesn't mean everyone else knows though, and it at least detoxifies the conversation to observers

so you mean they can use coded language to spread hate without being discovered?

Almost like a dog whistle, that only some can hear...

Re: MS will ban Forza players who add the confederate flag to their digital cars

#527

Post by FireBeyond »

norswap wrote: post #423
FireBeyond wrote: post #330

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It may have been made up, but I'm willing to bet that a not insignificant portion of people who are _now_ making it aren't doing so to make a point of saying "everything is just fine". My town had an issue with a cop posing out with a bunch of 3%ers at their gun store. This is in the PNW, and the owner of the store, born and raised in the PNW, has a Confederate flag neck tattoo. This was during some street protests.…

But you see the issue with that thought process right? You can imbue political meaning on anything that way, and ban arbitrary things. What if there is a (perhaps bogus) polemic, and your favorite singer is singled out as a racist/misogynist/communist/whatever, and the Bad People start blasting his songs at rallies? Are you supposed to stop listening to your favourite songs. Come to your own conclusions, but mine is:…

Your conclusion here is that these people were all making this sign for non-nefarious meanings.

On the contrary, it is contextually highly/entirely likely that they were _actively_ choosing to use it in a political manner. They _themselves_ were choosing to imbue political meaning on it, as much as anyone was choosing to _take_ meaning from it.

Re: MS will ban Forza players who add the confederate flag to their digital cars

#528

Post by [deleted] »

aka1234 wrote: post #341
sukilot wrote: post #309

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's an argument for banning swastikas, not banning anyone who displays a swastika. And before you say "come on, swastikas are pretty extreme", remember the moral panic we just went through when 4chan trolls convinced people that the OK hand sign was a "one-sided version ofna White Power" sign and got people fired from their jobs for making the sign.

> "That's an argument for banning swastikas, not banning anyone who displays a swastika." If you don't ban the person displaying the swastika, how can you possibly enforce banning swastikas? There must be a consequence for displaying the offending symbol, otherwise the rule is toothless. You remove the swastika, and the person just replaces it. What then? Just keep removing it and hoping the Nazi/edgelord/'troll' wil…

[deleted]

Re: MS will ban Forza players who add the confederate flag to their digital cars

#529

Post by BEEdwards »

drtillberg wrote: post #271

For the next act we'll censor images of the pyramids of Egypt, which were constructed by slave labor. And then we'll ban texts of the First Amendment to the U.S. Constitution which was influenced by an enlightenment thinker, Voltaire, who also supported the slave trade. And for our next act we'll ban images of Washington, D.C. with its columns and white marble, which glorifies Roman slave-owning society.

Great slippery slope argument, next time check your facts though, the Pyramids weren't built by slaves my dude.

https://www.harvardmagazine.com/2003/07/who-built-the-pyrami...

Re: MS will ban Forza players who add the confederate flag to their digital cars

#530

Post by renewiltord »

ggreer wrote: post #162
otterley wrote: post #2

“...and nothing of value was lost.”

Isn't there a famous racing car that has the design? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/General_Lee_(car)

The owner was going to repaint it to no longer have that, interestingly https://www.latimes.com/sports/sportsnow/la-sp-sn-bubba-wats...
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