Magic hat leaves behind a transformed craft beer industry in Vermont • Hacker News Board

Re: Magic hat leaves behind a transformed craft beer industry in Vermont

#91

Post by devNoise » Wed, Jul 01, 2020, 8:25 PM UTC

astura wrote: post #63

chrisseaton wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is the kind of craziness I see when I travel to the US https://www.taptrail.com/world-record-for-most-beer-taps/ I really struggle to believe they keep 366 beers in the best condition possible. And I don't get why it's a goal in the first place. I don't think anyone is making a meaningful choice between 366 beers and I bet they often get a disappointing one when they select something that nobody else has picked…

Well, that's a bar, not a brewery, and the topic here is breweries, not bars. If a bar has the sort of foot traffic/clientele/supply chain to support 366 different beers on tap then good for them, some do, it's not an easy operation to run. They also usually buy mini-kegs for quick turnover. If they are serving garbage quality beer that's been sitting for months then they probably wouldn't be in business. The place I…

Agree that 20+ taps is more likely a bar than a brewery. Though I think that a sixtel is more likely being used than a mini-keg.

Re: Magic hat leaves behind a transformed craft beer industry in Vermont

#92

Post by SOLAR_FIELDS » Wed, Jul 01, 2020, 8:25 PM UTC

m-ee wrote: post #80

Ductapemaster wrote: post #76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I was there a few years ago in the UK, and I found it to be a mixed bag. While most brewpubs I went to all had very similar beers in the styles one would expect, I found a couple places that really stuck out to me. For example, I discovered Brew Dog (originally from Scotland) while I was there and while, and they have since expanded to the US and kept producing great beer. That discovery, in contrast with being able…

I liked their beers but avoided ordering them after they got trigger happy with trademark lawsuits https://www.theguardian.com/business/2017/mar/28/brewdog-law...

Unfortunately they’re known for several sketchy business behaviors. It’s a shame because when I lived in Europe they were one of the few pubs that had unique craft beers in my town.

Re: Magic hat leaves behind a transformed craft beer industry in Vermont

#93

Post by baron_harkonnen » Wed, Jul 01, 2020, 8:28 PM UTC

kevin_thibedeau wrote: post #61

polygotdomain wrote: post #15

As a craft beer lover, I'm really at odds with what to think about where the scene is today. There are so many breweries out there that are brewing some really great beer and coming up with some interesting styles. In many places there's a recapturing of what I'd call "beer as place" with beirgartens, brew-pubs, and breweries themselves having a more open and inviting experience to hang out and drink beer. It's tasty…

I'm really getting tired of the IPA fad. I loved IPAs when they were a niche product and you could sample most of them in a reasonable time span. Now they're 90% of the shelf space and other deserving varieties are hard to find. Most of the newcomers are poorly executed hacks that follow the simplistic formula: IPA == bitter hops, therefore let's overload on hops. I won't drink any IPA that wasn't around 10 years ago…

I remember the last time IPAs where the major trend (where most of those 10+ year old IPAs come from). Honestly I feel this round of Hazy/NE IPAs is far less bitter than what was happening back then. Much more floral notes in IPAs and the focus seems to be much more on mouth feel.

It's funny to see IPAs dominate again, I remember when the last fad ended because hops became scarce and that gave way to the trend of absurdly strong imperial stouts. The sour trend was interesting but I'd much rather have a bad IPA than a bad sour.

And while IPAs dominate, at least on the east coast, there are a surprisingly large number of lagers, pilsners and lighter ales being put out by craft brewers, breweries are even making normal stouts! People always complain about the trending beers, but I still find more variety now that ever before in my drinking life.

Stronger beers will always dominate because frankly they're more interesting and diverse even if they aren't more drinkable. There's a lot more you can do with a barrel aged imperial stout than a lager.

Re: Magic hat leaves behind a transformed craft beer industry in Vermont

#94

Post by albedoa » Wed, Jul 01, 2020, 8:30 PM UTC

vb6sp6 wrote: post #66

kevin_thibedeau wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm really getting tired of the IPA fad. I loved IPAs when they were a niche product and you could sample most of them in a reasonable time span. Now they're 90% of the shelf space and other deserving varieties are hard to find. Most of the newcomers are poorly executed hacks that follow the simplistic formula: IPA == bitter hops, therefore let's overload on hops. I won't drink any IPA that wasn't around 10 years ago…

> I won't drink any IPA that wasn't around 10 years ago just to filter out the garbage You might be missing out on some really goods ones with this strategy

No kidding! Tree House was founded in 2011. You won't find anyone calling their beers formulaic garbage.

I understand the want to change it up. I seek out breweries that I haven't been to before or that have a deep catalog of beers that aren't found on shelves. Flights are a great way to try those beers, and their styles are usually of more variety.

One of my favorite breweries is Hermit Thrush in Brattleboro, Vermont. They specialize in sours, mostly aged. They source their aging barrels from all types of industries. Not only does the same recipe result in a different beer across multiple barrels, the same recipe results in a different beer each time a barrel is used.

If you look, you will find so much to explore. The space might feel dominated by IPAs, but other styles are benefitting from the rise of beer culture.

Re: Magic hat leaves behind a transformed craft beer industry in Vermont

#95

Post by setr » Wed, Jul 01, 2020, 8:32 PM UTC

vb6sp6 wrote: post #66

kevin_thibedeau wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm really getting tired of the IPA fad. I loved IPAs when they were a niche product and you could sample most of them in a reasonable time span. Now they're 90% of the shelf space and other deserving varieties are hard to find. Most of the newcomers are poorly executed hacks that follow the simplistic formula: IPA == bitter hops, therefore let's overload on hops. I won't drink any IPA that wasn't around 10 years ago…

> I won't drink any IPA that wasn't around 10 years ago just to filter out the garbage You might be missing out on some really goods ones with this strategy

Any filter will have false positives — the question is how many, how much does it matter, and how easy is it to implement.

I have a similar rule for video games

Re: Magic hat leaves behind a transformed craft beer industry in Vermont

#96

Post by catalogia » Wed, Jul 01, 2020, 8:35 PM UTC

AnotherGoodName wrote: post #79

kevin_thibedeau wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm really getting tired of the IPA fad. I loved IPAs when they were a niche product and you could sample most of them in a reasonable time span. Now they're 90% of the shelf space and other deserving varieties are hard to find. Most of the newcomers are poorly executed hacks that follow the simplistic formula: IPA == bitter hops, therefore let's overload on hops. I won't drink any IPA that wasn't around 10 years ago…

As someone that just wants a refreshing but quality lager there's nothing for me in this current wave. It's all group think. IPAs and Imperial Stouts everywhere. To the extent that you will find entire categories of beer on beer rating sites with nothing above a 4/5 in that category due to the groupthink that says more flavor = higher ratings. Refreshing, crisp and other such metrics don't count right now due to the…

I have similar preferences and share your frustration. I wonder if part of the problem is that "refreshing and crisp" are hard to quantify. Because you can't put objective numbers to them like IBU or ABV, you can't hope to sell your beer by having "better numbers" than your competitors.

Re: Magic hat leaves behind a transformed craft beer industry in Vermont

#97

Post by pessimizer » Wed, Jul 01, 2020, 8:35 PM UTC

linuxftw wrote: post #86

pessimizer wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I'm a firm believer that most of the major brands of beer are big due to taste, other than the economy beers. I guess I agree with this in a way, in that what most people are looking for are water substitutes that will give you a low-level buzz. I don't think most people want "good" brews, they were just told that's what they should want, and since the mass-market beer prices rose to nearly meet small brewery price…

> I guess I agree with this in a way, in that what most people are looking for are water substitutes that will give you a low-level buzz. This is not really what I meant. I mean to say, for instance, I prefer Sam Adams over 90/100 microbrews I've tried. Name the top 6 non-economy beers in the supermarket, I enjoy most of them more than 75/100 microbrews. Taste-wise, I think most microbrews are a bad product, even if…

Then I probably just disagree. Those macro-microbrews are overcarbonated and thin to my taste. I'd rather have a watery rice lager (i.e. whatever's cheapest) if I'm going in that direction.

TBH, though, preferring the top 6 macro-micros to 75/100 microbrews is praising with faint damnation. 1/4 of microbrews being better than all non-economy macro-micros is a good hit percentage in my book.

Re: Magic hat leaves behind a transformed craft beer industry in Vermont

#98

Post by albedoa » Wed, Jul 01, 2020, 8:37 PM UTC

gbarnes wrote: post #68

beezle wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sip of Sunshine has always been brewed at TwoRoads. Super Session is also brewed there. The rest of the line up is local at the Waitsfield or Warren facility. Double Sip came before Sip as well. Alchemist AFAIK only has local distribution within 25 miles of the brewery in Stowe by their own trucks/vans. (adding) If you find yourself in the central VT area, the Lawson's tap room is really nice facility, definitely che…

Nah, Alchemist has been distributing much further for about a year now. Easy to get in NY and MA now. Like, on the shelf at Wegmans easy.

This was marketed as an exclusive quarantine initiative, with distribution help from Night Shift. If it's not temporary, I'm happy to be wrong.

Re: Magic hat leaves behind a transformed craft beer industry in Vermont

#99

Post by mandelken » Wed, Jul 01, 2020, 8:38 PM UTC

coldpie wrote: post #60

itronitron wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you're feeling down on the US craft beer scene just visit Europe (after Covid runs it's course) and you may realize that US craft beer is quite strong by comparison.

I started drinking in the mid-2000s. This was around when the American craft brew scene was really taking over the nation, but the jokes all my European colleagues told were about how American beer is piss-water. Imagine my surprise when I went to Europe, this fabled land of "real beer", and found that they had at most one or two taps at the bar, and asked if I wanted "dark" or "light". No brand names, no styles, no…

Europe is far too big a geography to pin down beer, it's mostly concentrated in the UK, Ireland, Belgium, Netherlands, Germany and Czech where you find the right climate for the ingredients and hence the beer culture (of course you find beers in France, but they have a larger wine culture).

The differences between them are also huge with Irish dark stout, British pints without collar, German lager only made from basic ingredients, Belgian specialty beers, etc.

The effect of tradition and culture makes almost every beer in those regions taste perfectly decent and some very good, while in the US most are piss-water and some might indeed be very good.

With Bud Light still having the biggest market share, I believe the piss-water jokes still stand today.

Re: Magic hat leaves behind a transformed craft beer industry in Vermont

#100

Post by baron_harkonnen » Wed, Jul 01, 2020, 8:42 PM UTC

albedoa wrote: post #94

vb6sp6 wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I won't drink any IPA that wasn't around 10 years ago just to filter out the garbage You might be missing out on some really goods ones with this strategy

No kidding! Tree House was founded in 2011. You won't find anyone calling their beers formulaic garbage. I understand the want to change it up. I seek out breweries that I haven't been to before or that have a deep catalog of beers that aren't found on shelves. Flights are a great way to try those beers, and their styles are usually of more variety. One of my favorite breweries is Hermit Thrush in Brattleboro, Vermon…

Speaking of Tree House, I think we're seeing a shift where the East Coast is now the dominate force in the craft brewing scene. I've lived on both coasts multiple time and typically would always vouch for West coast beers dominating for a long time, but the stuff coming out of NE and NYC these days is amazing.

Even more shocking to me is what happened to ciders. Even with Seattle/WA ciders, which used to be far better than east coast stuff, taste like soda by comparison. There are a ton of incredible ciders on the east coast that are much drier, more nuanced and drinkable than current West Coast ciders. East coast ciders are a nice happy space between a sparkling wine and a beer. Honestly disappointed that the west coast has remained relatively stagnant recently.