Is this the reason why my Indian colleagues never reveal their last name?
California accuses Cisco of job discrimination based on Indian employee's caste
511–520 of 633 posts
Re: California accuses Cisco of job discrimination based on Indian employee's caste
#512Earlier quoted context omitted.
Fuck, does that mean you can ignore merit and let the guy who grew up with more privileges and less qualifications still get better opportunities than one with better qualifications just because the former is from a caste that is oppressed by someone else somewhere else? This will just increase dissatisfaction among non-reserved castes and reinforce the discrimination. Even then, what is wrong with the retired judge'…
The story of how a merited upper caste lost out to an unqualified reserved caste is another misleading anecdotal argument. Even merited reserved caste people face the same accusation. I have anecdotes for that as well, but I've never seen the accusers accept that there are merited lower castes. But what is revealing is the demography of the upper hierarchy of the government positions. There are progressively more upp…
You are just arguing what's on your mind without even properly understanding my arguments.
> As for the supreme court judge's comment - they are not all that righteous or infallible.
There is no point in talking about the person. Point me what is wrong in his comment.
> The story of how a merited upper caste lost out to an unqualified reserved caste is another misleading anecdotal argument.
Because you don'taccept that it happens, it is misleading, lol. In NITs/IITs, some people get seats with JEE rankings of 100K, which are otherwise allotted within 10K without reservation. And it is well known that most of people are economically well-off to pay for coaching and study materials (self studying candidates are extremely rare).
Some years ago, a scheduled caste student from a middle class family who got All India Rank 1 in JEE Mains and got lot of publicity got 100+ rank in JEE advanced. If he was a general category student, he couldn't get CSE in IIT Bombay, but he got CSE seat by reservation. Now imagine a person who got 90th something rank in JEE advanced, coming from similar or worse economical background, and still missed the seat in top institution because someone thought that is the way to do reservation.
Re: California accuses Cisco of job discrimination based on Indian employee's caste
#513Earlier quoted context omitted.
I guess this does not stop in Jobs but also in VC Funding . Most VCs/Seed funds are run by few upper caste Indians . They do have discrimination if you come from a backward caste . if you belong to the same caste , chances of getting a fund are more .
What is a "backward caste"? Haven't heard this term before
I have heard this term often but never gotten used to it being used to describe an entire ethnic group nonchallantly - like the comment you are replyig to. I have had several conversations with Indian colleagues where some would use this term to describe other non-privileged classes as "backward" so matter of factly. This is racism of the quintessential kind.
Re: California accuses Cisco of job discrimination based on Indian employee's caste
#514Earlier quoted context omitted.
“Put them on notice”? “American company”? What century is this? There are innumerable businesses in the USA where groups of people speak different languages together. I routinely speak Spanish with people in stores, car repair places, farms etc and most of them seem to be US citizens simply more comfortable in Spanish than English. Why shouldn’t US citizens use the language they want? (BTW I come from a country where…
It would be highly unusual to run meetings like standup where nobody else spoke the language two people were talking in. It’s different if they’re talking outside of a meeting.
Nobody mentioned anything about "in a meeting", so how are we supposed to divine that that's what you meant?
Re: California accuses Cisco of job discrimination based on Indian employee's caste
#515Re: California accuses Cisco of job discrimination based on Indian employee's caste
#516Earlier quoted context omitted.
Is that just an Indian thing? Because in my family, here in Rural Iowa, the in-laws include a woman from New Delhi, Valencia Spain, Baguio Philippines, 2nd generation Elba Italy, Korea. That doesn't count the New Englanders and Appalachians (which is a whole different thing than Iowan). I mention it because, a spouse of a different culture can be a wonderful thing. Language, food, daily culture are a constant source…
Cultural differences are a mere fig leaf for racism. Culture doesn't differ in a big way at all amongst castes. Watch his reply to your post where he cleverly passes off muslims and Christians as invader cultures, without you noticing.
> Cultural differences are a mere fig leaf for racism. Culture doesn't differ in a big way at all amongst castes.
Right I totally forgot about the different languages that exist in India. Or the different religious ceremonies. Or the different Gods people worship. All those must somehow not mean the culture is different.
> Watch his reply to your post where he cleverly passes off muslims and Christians as invader cultures, without you noticing.
Those are your words, not mine. I suggested no such thing. The people of India today, irrespective of their religions, are all equally Indians. But to claim that there were no religious wars in the past (and even the present) and that there was no effect of religious conversion on hardening of stance on culture in Hinduism is naive and ignoring a big problem.
There is also a HUGE difference between talking about people today vs 5 centuries ago. We should be able to talk openly about the impact of foreign conquests in India without negatively impacting the people of those religions in the country today.
Re: California accuses Cisco of job discrimination based on Indian employee's caste
#517Earlier quoted context omitted.
Fair points. I don't have historical data, but my observation is that the issue of brahmins controlling/dominating lot of sectors was a real problem at some point and the reservation system was a populist response that did provide some benefit for oppressed castes, but created a whole bunch of other problems and unintended consequences. And its still remains such a hot button populist issue no political party would d…
iyer or iyengar is their traditional surname probably. same way as a family name in the US. why discriminate against iyers because they want to have a surname of their choice? most folks would be proud of their surnames. Is there a community that feels horrible about their surname?
No, these are not the traditional surnames. What I am referring to is a practice of legally changing the last name (typically father's or grand father's name) to Iyer or Iyengar. To me its a clear on your face statement that the person belongs to that caste and wants to flaunt it.
Re: California accuses Cisco of job discrimination based on Indian employee's caste
#518Earlier quoted context omitted.
100% agreed, I worked for a big 3 Letter Corp and heard manager speaking in his native language of the State (same as the company was located) to another member of team from same State, saying please work a little and i will promote you as a manager ,who will i do it for, if not for you. In the meantime, we were working our ass off and got nothing. Its there for real, you can easily see it - If you join a multination…
What is a "big 3 letter corp"? Haven't heard this phrase before.
IBM or TCS (Tata Consulting Services).
Re: California accuses Cisco of job discrimination based on Indian employee's caste
#519I've heard this argument alot. To people saying caste isn't that big of an issue in contemporary india, esp in the urban areas: let's ask an Indian parent if they'd be comfortable having their child marry someone they think is of a "lower caste" than theirs. THIS is the best litmus test, quick, cheap and easy way to clear all doubts on the contemporary caste question. The things is inter-caste marriage is the best wa…
> let's ask an Indian parent if they'd be comfortable having their child marry someone they think is of a "lower caste" than theirs. THIS is the best litmus test, quick, cheap and easy way to clear all doubts on the contemporary caste question. This test will fail because it doesn't account for what truly is caste in people's minds. Even among those who do not want to discriminate, different castes represent differen…
As someone married to someone from a different language and culture, I can say that those differences are not as insurmountable as they might seem, and the effort to overcome them is repaid many times over if you enjoy expanding your horizons.
Re: California accuses Cisco of job discrimination based on Indian employee's caste
#520I've heard this argument alot. To people saying caste isn't that big of an issue in contemporary india, esp in the urban areas: let's ask an Indian parent if they'd be comfortable having their child marry someone they think is of a "lower caste" than theirs. THIS is the best litmus test, quick, cheap and easy way to clear all doubts on the contemporary caste question. The things is inter-caste marriage is the best wa…
> let's ask an Indian parent if they'd be comfortable having their child marry someone they think is of a "lower caste" than theirs. THIS is the best litmus test, quick, cheap and easy way to clear all doubts on the contemporary caste question. This test will fail because it doesn't account for what truly is caste in people's minds. Even among those who do not want to discriminate, different castes represent differen…
You can modify the test to give them two choices, a partner that is of higher caste and another that is of lower caste - all things being equal (wealth, health, even skin color). If they were truly non-discriminatory, and only cared about preserving their "culture", they should reject either one with equal probability.