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Viewpoint: 'I feel like I was accidentally hired'

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Re: Viewpoint: 'I feel like I was accidentally hired'

#141

Post by _y5hn »

SpicyLemonZest wrote: post #117
komali2 wrote: post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Try asking some POC friends or colleagues! Get their perspective. Another user mentioned that it feels like kneeling on the ground and using "baby talk." That's not what's being said here. It's simply taking a moment to observe yourself and other colleagues potentially engaging in unconscious (or even conscious - you may have an avowed racist hiding it very well on the team!) bias. This is being an ally. It's not pat…

Every POC I know thinks that these kinds of efforts are often, although not always, patronizing. (In some cases even beyond patronizing; I've heard a few people say it's actively hurting their career, because they spend so much time being voluntold into diversity discussions that it cuts into their bandwidth for their real job.)

Then look at it as opportunity.

Re: Viewpoint: 'I feel like I was accidentally hired'

#142

Post by komali2 »

numakerg wrote: post #120
ibudiallo wrote: post #107

Hey everyone, author here. It seems like this post have been flagged, but I'd like to add a little comment here so it may clarify things. First, a little over a week ago we were having a similar discussion here [1] and I promised I'd post my article about it. This is the article. Second, I want people to understand that this is a complex issue and the solution might/should be as complex. It's not a case of, OK let's…

Thank you for writing this. If there's at least one thing I hope everyone can agree is a positive, it's people sharing their perspectives like this. > look around the office, you immediately notice that black people aren't there. You're right, there aren't. One in ten people in my city is black, but I would estimate* fewer than one in forty developers at my work are. But there were just as few in my college classes,…

It's not exclusionary.

I have almost no say at what happens at my local University. Do you? I can at most pay taxes, write my representatives, and maybe a couple other ancillary things.

What I can control to a huge degree is who my company hires and how I treat my colleagues.

Seeking out how to help POC programmers in the workforce doesn't mean we can't also work to improve the American education gap. We have a lot of time in the day, after all.

Re: Viewpoint: 'I feel like I was accidentally hired'

#143

Post by born_a_skeptic »

mtgp1000 wrote: post #126

I feel like we are all ignoring the fact that literally any perceived disrespect can be blamed on racism, especially if you've been conditioned to look for it, and it's often impractical or impossible to prove otherwise, particularly once the mob has mobilized. Being told you're a victim all your life can make you feel like a victim, even when you aren't. And now that victimhood is currency, all I see as a foreigner…

Identity politics.

Re: Viewpoint: 'I feel like I was accidentally hired'

#144

Post by zosima »

komali2 wrote: post #76
zosima wrote: post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So all of these groups choose to live in separate neighborhoods, because they all are racist to each other? Not because they want to be around people that are similar to themselves? And the fact that the same pattern shows up basically everywhere. In Africa, Asia, Europe, North America and to some extent South America, does not change your perception?

> So all of these groups choose to live in separate neighborhoods, because they all are racist to each other? No, because the empowered class artificially created ghettos, and either forced racial separation directly or indirectly by removing access to societal resources, forcing communities to form to compensate. Of course Cuban refugees will form Spanish speaking communities in a hostile Florida - everything is in…

Pray, tell. Why would these repressed Cubans not live together with hispanics, in hispanic ghettos. Speaking the same language and all.

After all, that would make them a stronger force, and definitely give them more diversity.

Re: Viewpoint: 'I feel like I was accidentally hired'

#145

Post by punkbit »

o-__-o wrote: post #103

All of these comments and I’m left wondering if I’m the only black person commenting in this thread. I’ve been passed up for promotions, fired, and hired based solely on my color. I keep moving on but y’all it’s been 20 years of this. And it just started getting a little better in the past 3 years but is a total gamble based on where you work. In my current Fortune 500 job, I was hired for my expertise then was moved…

I haven't read the comments but...

I'm black and a developer (not just a dev, I'm a full stack, audiovisual generalist, animation, motion graphics, ui/ux, illustrator), started in the end 90s and professionally since 2008?!

Got no idea if I ever been put aside because of my skin colour, but my photo and stuff is public for anybody prior to any interview and stuff - so if that happened, great, fuck them, I don't want to have to deal with them.

I also don't wear suits and stuff like that, and for a lot of years I used to take my skateboard to interviews and always spoke my mind.

My afro is also huge, I also wear whatever I want, but managed to work in a fintech where people wear suits and stuff.

I do know that may pay is usually lower then other people but don't think that's related to my skin colour but because I don't do any ass licking! Or maybe because I'm shit :)

My biggest problem nowadays is that there are a lot of people in the scene for money and this obsession for long recruitment processes, literally putting people in risk of being homeless. I also find that this same people expect you to behave in a certain way and have a "certain culture" - there are countless youtube videos of people offering what seems to be tutorials on what to say in interviews, etc - I find that absolutely ridiculous and inhuman! Sick and sad people!

So that's who I relate with, good people, people who work hard and still struggle even though! But yes, of course I'd like to see other people like me once in awhile too.

Re: Viewpoint: 'I feel like I was accidentally hired'

#146

Post by bryan_w »

Baeocystin wrote: post #123
foogazi wrote: post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> for instance you'll find much higher black representation in the public sector, specifically in the federal government Do you know why that is? Maybe government work is more inclusive, like the military

Accessible job stability and good benefits. The overall pay is lower than the private sector, but if you're looking for stable income first and foremost, working for the government is an excellent option. This stability will be particularly appealing for people who grew up in poverty. Source: My father worked for the government, and my grandfather was a working-class immigrant who started with nothing, so money was t…

Can confirm, I'm black, and growing up I would often hear my parents and aunts often say that the government jobs were the best because it was stable

Re: Viewpoint: 'I feel like I was accidentally hired'

#147

Post by jjeaff »

hombre_fatal wrote: post #95
komali2 wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> white people are born with the original sin of racism. No, it doesn't, but this is generally speaking a perfect encapsulation of the "all lives matter" perspective, which is morally incorrect, usually not because of raw KKK level hatred or racism but instead simple ignorance of what unconscious bias and racism is really like for POC in America. > I find it incredibly patronizing to actively pursue "okay, black guy…

I feel like, to unmask me as unempathic, you ignored the rest of my post that starts with "a leadership + empathy trait..." where I attempt to generalize the goal here instead of this myopic "POC" narrow-vision. My empathy doesn't need Sparknotes for who to help, just the built-in human radar we have where we can parcel out the social hierarchy of a group. When you have the empathy I described, you don't need a custo…

Your writing reads as if you think of yourself as a person free of all unconscious bias and so self-aware of your actions that you would instantly spot any internal bias and immediately correct. It seems unlikely that is the case.

Re: Viewpoint: 'I feel like I was accidentally hired'

#148

Post by forgot_user1234 »

I am really curious about brown people.

How come Indians succeed in tech? Why do we have so many Indians in tech?

if it's just the skin colour. Why do Indians in tech rise to the top.

P.S. - Before you try to cancel me - I am not trying to start a flame war. I am curious about your explanation.

Re: Viewpoint: 'I feel like I was accidentally hired'

#149

Post by komali2 »

dafoex wrote: post #74
rootusrootus wrote: post #12

This seems like such a hard problem to really solve, since so much of what we consider racism, or at least borderline racism, has a significant basis in fundamental human thinking. I really feel for the guy, but it's hard to know where to start. I try really hard to ignore color, but I'm not immune to at least noticing . Then I try hard not to double-take. It's completely expected to meet Indians at the workplace, bu…

For the longest time I felt like I didn't notice race: yeah, if I looked it was there, and the town I grew up in and live in is pretty multicultural, so it wasn't a novel thing to see people of different colours. Sadly, as I've become more aware of the bitter division of race present in some people, I feel that I've not only become acutely aware of the races around me as if its something strange and unexpected, but I…

The social discomfort is par for the course for American POC. Did that white lady cross the street cause she's afraid of me, or my dog? All day, every day. Now you and I get to experience some of this discomfort and through our experience we can work to make the world a bit better and more equitable.

Specifically for your social distancing example, I've found it's far too confrontational to ask people to step away from me. In lines, if someone is up my asshole, I simply offer them to go in front of me, then give 6ft of space. Or in a grocery store, I walk away and come back to get what I need later.

Re: Viewpoint: 'I feel like I was accidentally hired'

#150

Post by born_a_skeptic »

I don't know who is right, but I always think it's always good to look at important issues from multiple points of views.

If anyone is interested in understanding another point of view, check out Tucker Carlson. He has black guests on all the time who make a pretty good counter-case and provide their perspective.

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