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An even worse anti-encryption bill than EARN IT

cyberlaw.stanford.edu

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Re: An even worse anti-encryption bill than EARN IT

#91

Post by _tw9j »

desmondw wrote: post #48
pensatoio wrote: post #17

These bills terrify me. A lot of stuff happens in politics that’s frustrating, and much of it doesn’t catch my attention. There’s something about the pure ignorance that goes into breaking encryption that I can’t comprehend. I can understand when bills come through and the extreme differences in opinion are the result of different interpretations of facts and truth, but when it comes to encryption, there is no safe p…

I think ironically a bill like this passing would lead to more decentralization of services -- making their goals of monitoring information even harder.

They don't want to track people who will use those decentralized services. Simple as that.

They want control over majority. Nothing else. Any legal business will be required to do what law requires them and it will affect every citizen.

I have no hope given the stupidity of my country to do something against acts like [1] personal data protection law or the decryption act. US going towards that road only means it's easier to justify our country and many others to go even higher. Soon a mandatory camera inside house for legal citizen.

1] https://carnegieindia.org/2020/03/09/what-is-in-india-s-swee...

Re: An even worse anti-encryption bill than EARN IT

#92

Post by p_l »

redis_mlc wrote: post #76
pietroglyph wrote: post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Our word used to mean something. > But now? How can we hold a higher ground than China when our own police forces use the very same tactics against our own protesters? How can we accuse the other side of building concentration camps when we have our own? But we’ve had things like this for a long time. The police have acted like they do for generations, we had concentration camps for Japanese people during World War…

> we had concentration camps for Japanese people during World War II I study WW2, and it's important to be factual. The correct term is internment camps. Japanese-Americans usually lost their property, but the purpose was to locate them in central locations, not to re-educate or liquidate them, as our enemies did to the Allies. For that time in history, it could be argued that the decision made sense. Japanese subs d…

That's what concentration camp is for. To concentrate and control.

There were separate death camps (sometimes combined) that involved direct train-to-killing-field pipelines, and most concentration camps involved work in horrible conditions, but that's because of further goals above relocation.

Re: An even worse anti-encryption bill than EARN IT

#93

Post by p_l »

raxxorrax wrote: post #42
AnthonyMouse wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> He was probably the most popular political leader of all the time. Worth noting that their first major win was in response to the stock market crash, but his popularity really only soared after they took power and imposed censorship. Free speech not such a virtue in Nazi Germany. Much easier to be popular when nobody is allowed to say anything against you.

People hat Nazi spies within their own homes that made sure nobodY said anything wrong. Have a diary about such a couple. They made 200 people careful about what to say. Of course free speech was pretty much non-existent.

Most dissent was from somewhat popular leftist movements, that were directly targeted by any anti-free speech actions.

If you weren't, as americans would say, a "commie"? You felt like you won.

Re: An even worse anti-encryption bill than EARN IT

#94

Post by kelnos »

austincheney wrote: post #21

The solution to policies like this is serverless or point-to-point systems. As an application publisher you cannot be held liable or obligated towards that which you do not possess and are, by design, not capable of possessing. As an example consider copyright law and BitTorrent. BitTorrent provides a software application and protocol but not servers or services, so the BitTorrent software is never liable for the cop…

The solution is to vote out idiots who support things like this, and get the government actually working for its citizens again, not against it. That's hard, and feels damn near impossible sometimes, but it's required. You can't fix social problems with clever technological workarounds.

Re: An even worse anti-encryption bill than EARN IT

#95

Post by bilegeek »

incompatible wrote: post #34
a012 wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I briefly read the doc and it requires assistance to decrypt local device storage and remote storage. So it's a full spectrum demand for decrypting data.

Going after systems that have over a million users would leave a pretty big loophole for niche vendors and open source. But with such a big precedent, those could easily be targeted later.

For those, like you and me, who have been touting open-source as a beacon of hope: I'm sorry, we're done for.

First, anything that has more than a gig of memory and sells over a million units must be engineered according to the government's whims. That is pretty much ANYTHING useful nowadays. Hardware will now spy on you. And even though there is old hardware, and theoretically zero-trust programming techniques out there, that won't matter because:

They will go after open-source projects.

Any single method alone wouldn't work, but if pushed all at once, they could smother us. File lawsuits against and harass not just maintainers, but contributors and possibly even users; force registrars to de-register domains, and search engines to forget links; have ISP's stop allowing Tor connections, or possibly even implement whitelists of all websites instead of blacklists of "bad" ones.

Without secure computers, in today's world, there is no organized protest; there is no organized opposition; there is no truly effectual dissent, because the other side can see all and end it before it becomes an issue. And even then... gestures wildly.

Constitutionality means jack without both belief and enforcement. We have neither; a public split and jaded, and a government empowered in the worst possible way. And even if this doesn't pass - and that is a horrifyingly small if - the very fact that this is even being proposed is evidence that the battle is close to being lost completely. There is no second chance in this chase, and we are going to trip and fall eventually.

Though hope may be lost for us, may we retain hope that our descendants are at least somewhat at peace with the world we have given them.

Re: An even worse anti-encryption bill than EARN IT

#96

Post by giancarlostoro »

pensatoio wrote: post #17

These bills terrify me. A lot of stuff happens in politics that’s frustrating, and much of it doesn’t catch my attention. There’s something about the pure ignorance that goes into breaking encryption that I can’t comprehend. I can understand when bills come through and the extreme differences in opinion are the result of different interpretations of facts and truth, but when it comes to encryption, there is no safe p…

Whats worst is these should all be entirely illegal. Its literally warrantless searching.

Re: An even worse anti-encryption bill than EARN IT

#98

Post by Aeolun »

nix23 wrote: post #85
eitland wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That was some sloppy writing by me. I've edited my previous post to avoid further confusion. (It is about data traffic, not ordinary customs.)

But take it easy, in Switzerland we want to trow 12 y/o into prisons for being (potentially) a dangerous person (terrorism), not for being a criminal but being potentially one in the future (not far away from a KGB mindset if you ask me)

I presume they must have done something like actually preparing a terrorist attack right?

It’s hard to decide what to do with children in such a scenario, but I cannot imagine prison is the best solution.

Re: An even worse anti-encryption bill than EARN IT

#99

Post by coldcode »

proverbialbunny wrote: post #60
DyslexicAtheist wrote: post #55

who would be he people in congress backing this bill? is there a list?

It says at the top of the article >On Tuesday, June 23, Senators Graham (R-SC), Cotton (R-AR), and Blackburn (R-TN) introduced a bill that is a full-frontal nuclear assault on encryption in the United States. As a general rule of thumb with how US politics have been going, this bill will probably be split down party line.

Graham has some compromat on him (he used to hate Trump and suddenly became his biggest supporter over night), Cotton was the guy who wanted all protesters killed, I have no clue on Blackburn. But this bill has zero chance of passing; it's merely yet another case of political grandstanding. Lots of things get introduced that can never pass.

Re: An even worse anti-encryption bill than EARN IT

#100

Post by stilley2 »

giancarlostoro wrote: post #96
pensatoio wrote: post #17

These bills terrify me. A lot of stuff happens in politics that’s frustrating, and much of it doesn’t catch my attention. There’s something about the pure ignorance that goes into breaking encryption that I can’t comprehend. I can understand when bills come through and the extreme differences in opinion are the result of different interpretations of facts and truth, but when it comes to encryption, there is no safe p…

Whats worst is these should all be entirely illegal. Its literally warrantless searching.

I'm not in favor of the bill, but a warrant is still required (at least for domestic stuff).
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