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Crows’ ability to discriminate between languages

corvidresearch.blog

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Re: Crows’ ability to discriminate between languages

#41

Post by vmception »

phreeza wrote: post #22
vmception wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There was a movie where the aliens patiently let humans try to devise a way to teach a way to communicate, but they were teaching the humans a superior way of communicating the whole time. Would be a spoiler if I said the movie name and you hadn't seen it. I wouldn't be surprised if various domestic and cohabiting animals feel that way about us. A lot of what we do is built around verbal nuance but isn't really neces…

If you are talking about the movie that I think you are talking about, I don't think it is really so much about a superior way of communicating, just a different one.

It was superior to what the humans were trying to teach the visitors which was more akin to putting a primate through a communication test.

Re: Crows’ ability to discriminate between languages

#42

Post by wespiser_2018 »

cycomanic wrote: post #24
wespiser_2018 wrote: post #17

If crows are so smart, then why do they eat our garbage?

Not sure if you're being sarcastic. I guess the better question would be, if we are smart why are we throwing away so much useful stuff?

Yea, it's a joke. I guess it doesn't come across well, but if you say it in person while people are talking about crows, people will usually laugh :)

Re: Crows’ ability to discriminate between languages

#43

Post by jon_elbrook »

MaxBarraclough wrote: post #30
Hokusai wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Obesity is largely a function of culture. It relates to sugary and fatty food availability. So, yes it's cultural and can be improved by improved the system. But, its root is the incapability of human beings on avoiding the 'temptation' of unhealthy food. Asking people to stop eating too much and too bad does not work because our survival instincts tell us that to not eat when you can is stupid. So, changes in avai…

Sure, and I didn't mean to come across as obtuse, my point was that it's hard to find truly culture-insensitive aspects of the human experience. Even the basics like our tastes in food, and what traits we find physically attractive, are steered by culture. You're right of course that ultimately we're wired to enjoy sugar, fat, and salt, in a way that works against our health when they are available in effectively lim…

>I don't agree with Most of our behaviour is based on instinct. We allow perfect strangers into our homes to fix the plumbing.

And we stay in the house to keep watch on them.

>A baby can learn to enjoy the company of a Malamute. Even our instinct to avoid being eaten by wolves,

You have to first establish that we have an instinct to avoid being eaten by wolves. And how that would work in humans that don't live where there are wolves for thousands of years.....

Re: Crows’ ability to discriminate between languages

#44

Post by jon_elbrook »

MaxBarraclough wrote: post #28
Hokusai wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have to disagree. I see the opposite problem. We think too highly of human intelligence, we should be more humble. Our most important source of intelligence is culture. We copy what we see others doing and that make us think that we are smart. It's the equivalent to see a Mathematical proof and think that we could also have done it. Most of our behaviour is based on instinct. That is why it's so hard to lose weight…

> Most of our behaviour is based on instinct. That is why it's so hard to lose weight Obesity is largely a function of culture.

If that is the case, then why are people in the same culture not equally fat?

Re: Crows’ ability to discriminate between languages

#45

Post by qw »

nineparts wrote: post #40
qw wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I knew a dog (German Shepard) that was scared by another dog of a different breed (flat coated retriever) when she was young. The rest of her life she was really careful around dogs of the attacker's colour, and aggressive against dogs of the breed as the "bad" dog. If a dog was both the same colour and breed you had to hold the leash tight... I guess the dogs in Goa have similar experiences. They mostly associate to…

And how many "few locals" is enough for prejudice to turn into statistic?

For a dog, one bad experience can be enough. They can also spread their behaviour to other dogs that notice that they are afraid in certain situations. These dogs will "teach" other dogs and the behaviour spreads quickly.

Re: Crows’ ability to discriminate between languages

#46

Post by yareally »

qw wrote: post #45
nineparts wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And how many "few locals" is enough for prejudice to turn into statistic?

For a dog, one bad experience can be enough. They can also spread their behaviour to other dogs that notice that they are afraid in certain situations. These dogs will "teach" other dogs and the behaviour spreads quickly.

Yep, animals learn from bad experiences quite fast. My little parrot won't go near towels anymore because we used to wrap him in one so he would hold still while trimming his nails. This doesn't hurt the bird and not doing it makes it hard for them to walk, but the sounds and struggle emmited by that pint sized green cheeked conure would make the unaware think I was torturing him.

Now, he won't even let us wrap him in a towel after he decides to dunk himself in his water bowl for a bath. No matter how wet, cold and pathetic he looks (birds smell like a wet potato after a bath), he won't let us dry him off.

Re: Crows’ ability to discriminate between languages

#47

Post by fuzzfactor »

A few years ago a lost dog came to our small laboratory parking lot from the nearby neighborhood.

Not a real stray just a misplaced house dog, but it was more fearful than most. When somebody went out there and talked to it the dog hid underneath a parked car and would not come out.

A few more people tried even bringing snacks but doggie wouldn't budge.

After about ten more minutes another worker goes out there, looks under the car and talks to the dog in spanish, and the dog comes out wagging its tail.

We do have many languages natively spoken by our people and up until that point none had come close to a spanish accent.

And then there's this:

basically a near-transcript of a Paul Harvey broadcast from the old ABC Radio

https://bible.org/illustration/bozo-elephant

Re: Crows’ ability to discriminate between languages

#49

Post by [deleted] »

ianai wrote: post #14

Between the zoonotic origins of covid (and just epidemiology generally) and the book “are we smart enough to know how smart animals are” by Franz de Waal I’m really resetting my understanding of life. Animals are just way way smarter than we give them credit for - not the least because of eons of telling ourselves we’re the living beings and they’re the automatons (seriously, go read how Descartes wrote about them).…

[deleted]

Re: Crows’ ability to discriminate between languages

#50

Post by Hokusai »

jon_elbrook wrote: post #44
MaxBarraclough wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Most of our behaviour is based on instinct. That is why it's so hard to lose weight Obesity is largely a function of culture.

If that is the case, then why are people in the same culture not equally fat?

Because it's not the only factor. Culture is an important factor but not the only one.

Income is another factor. Richer people had access to better food and better medical advice that pressures then to eat healthier.

Genetics are also another factor. Some people are better at accumulating fat than others.

That other elements does not remove cultural influence. You eat what is available to you in your region, what your parents cook, etc.

e.g. A country may tax sugary drinks to reduce availability and that reduces obesity in the country.

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