Earlier quoted context omitted.
Please post the spoiler in a few days, I have no idea but want to watch this.
I think parent poster is referring to Arrival: https://www.imdb.com/title/tt2543164/
The book was better :)
Crows’ ability to discriminate between languages
21–30 of 54 posts
Re: Crows’ ability to discriminate between languages
#22This discussion on crow vocalizations linked in the blog post was a bit more interesting to me: https://corvidresearch.blog/2019/03/14/crow-vocalizations-pa... Demonstrates how little we know! Our inability to understand the relatively-simpler communication of other life on earth generally makes me think we would fail spectacularly if we ever meet aliens...
There was a movie where the aliens patiently let humans try to devise a way to teach a way to communicate, but they were teaching the humans a superior way of communicating the whole time. Would be a spoiler if I said the movie name and you hadn't seen it. I wouldn't be surprised if various domestic and cohabiting animals feel that way about us. A lot of what we do is built around verbal nuance but isn't really neces…
If you are talking about the movie that I think you are talking about, I don't think it is really so much about a superior way of communicating, just a different one.
Re: Crows’ ability to discriminate between languages
#23If crows are so smart, then why do they eat our garbage?
Because we are not smart enough to figure out how to stop being so wasteful?
Re: Crows’ ability to discriminate between languages
#24If crows are so smart, then why do they eat our garbage?
Not sure if you're being sarcastic.
I guess the better question would be, if we are smart why are we throwing away so much useful stuff?
Re: Crows’ ability to discriminate between languages
#25"As with the carrion crow study, when these crows were presented with playback of a more familiar acoustic style—in this case a Japanese speaker—they didn’t show a strong reaction. Play them what was likely a completely unfamiliar language—Dutch—and the crows were rapt. Or at least they acted more vigilant and positioned themselves closer to the speaker. In other words, large-billed crows were able to discriminate be…
For reference, this testing process is similar to a standard one used with human infants. This paper isn't one cited by the crow paper, it's just one I'm familiar with that uses a similar process; it may be connected to the crow paper through a citation chain, as some of their cites also deal with human infants.
Re: Crows’ ability to discriminate between languages
#26Between the zoonotic origins of covid (and just epidemiology generally) and the book “are we smart enough to know how smart animals are” by Franz de Waal I’m really resetting my understanding of life. Animals are just way way smarter than we give them credit for - not the least because of eons of telling ourselves we’re the living beings and they’re the automatons (seriously, go read how Descartes wrote about them).…
I have to disagree. I see the opposite problem. We think too highly of human intelligence, we should be more humble.
Our most important source of intelligence is culture. We copy what we see others doing and that make us think that we are smart. It's the equivalent to see a Mathematical proof and think that we could also have done it.
Most of our behaviour is based on instinct. That is why it's so hard to lose weight or study an uninteresting topic.
It took humanity one hundred thousand years to realize that writing symbols allowed for a good communication system. And we did that by copy and error, a kind of evolutive process. Nobody sit down for hours until they invented writing.
So, you see the glass half full, I see it half empty, I guess.
But there is usefulness in seeing the glass half empty. As, it makes us more aware of our lakings and biases.
This opinion, I formed by reading many other opinions adding one more step on the evolution of knowledge (maybe I'm wrong and it's just a dead end thou)
Re: Crows’ ability to discriminate between languages
#27this reminds me racist dogs in Goa (India)
been staying on beach, dogs very friendly towards me (your Aryan white), forming even circle around me when I sat down on beach in early morning, but God forbid (dark) looking local tried to go on beach, they scared him away. I noticed this actually in some other tourist places as well, dogs being friendly to tourists while aggressive with locals
but if it makes anyone feel happy, dogs in Agra don't indiscriminate, I've seen them attacking badly local children same as they attacked me when going in morning to Taj Mahal, only place in India with aggressive dogs (towards me) I experienced
Re: Crows’ ability to discriminate between languages
#28Between the zoonotic origins of covid (and just epidemiology generally) and the book “are we smart enough to know how smart animals are” by Franz de Waal I’m really resetting my understanding of life. Animals are just way way smarter than we give them credit for - not the least because of eons of telling ourselves we’re the living beings and they’re the automatons (seriously, go read how Descartes wrote about them).…
I have to disagree. I see the opposite problem. We think too highly of human intelligence, we should be more humble. Our most important source of intelligence is culture. We copy what we see others doing and that make us think that we are smart. It's the equivalent to see a Mathematical proof and think that we could also have done it. Most of our behaviour is based on instinct. That is why it's so hard to lose weight…
> Most of our behaviour is based on instinct. That is why it's so hard to lose weight
Obesity is largely a function of culture.
Re: Crows’ ability to discriminate between languages
#29Earlier quoted context omitted.
I have to disagree. I see the opposite problem. We think too highly of human intelligence, we should be more humble. Our most important source of intelligence is culture. We copy what we see others doing and that make us think that we are smart. It's the equivalent to see a Mathematical proof and think that we could also have done it. Most of our behaviour is based on instinct. That is why it's so hard to lose weight…
> Most of our behaviour is based on instinct. That is why it's so hard to lose weight Obesity is largely a function of culture.
> Obesity is largely a function of culture.
It relates to sugary and fatty food availability. So, yes it's cultural and can be improved by improved the system.
But, its root is the incapability of human beings on avoiding the 'temptation' of unhealthy food.
Asking people to stop eating too much and too bad does not work because our survival instincts tell us that to not eat when you can is stupid. So, changes in availability of unhealthy food are needed to improve the population health.
Your point does not invalidate my point, but both describe our society.
Re: Crows’ ability to discriminate between languages
#30Earlier quoted context omitted.
> Most of our behaviour is based on instinct. That is why it's so hard to lose weight Obesity is largely a function of culture.
> Obesity is largely a function of culture. It relates to sugary and fatty food availability. So, yes it's cultural and can be improved by improved the system. But, its root is the incapability of human beings on avoiding the 'temptation' of unhealthy food. Asking people to stop eating too much and too bad does not work because our survival instincts tell us that to not eat when you can is stupid. So, changes in avai…
Sure, and I didn't mean to come across as obtuse, my point was that it's hard to find truly culture-insensitive aspects of the human experience.
Even the basics like our tastes in food, and what traits we find physically attractive, are steered by culture. You're right of course that ultimately we're wired to enjoy sugar, fat, and salt, in a way that works against our health when they are available in effectively limitless quantities.
I don't agree with Most of our behaviour is based on instinct. We allow perfect strangers into our homes to fix the plumbing. (Bruce Schneier wrote a great book about this kind of trust. [0]) A baby can learn to enjoy the company of a Malamute. Even our instinct to avoid being eaten by wolves, seems to be negotiable.
> changes in availability of unhealthy food are needed to improve the population health.
Agreed.