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I don't want a hustler

andrewacove.posterous.com

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Re: I don't want a hustler

#11

Post by andrewacove »

tgriesser wrote: post #3

I will readily take a business-minded, action-oriented cofounder who gets shit done. I have absolutely no interest in a hustler. In my mind, that is the absolute definition of a hustler, someone who will get shit done. Predicating that hustlers are sleazy, or have questionable ethics, or don't value technical skill sets is the same as assuming that "hackers" are people who break into computers. Sure there are probabl…

> the summary is that good hustlers are hard to come by

That's true, but I'll add to it. I've met good hustlers - people who _get shit done_ - but they still leverage sleazy tactics. And that's the problem. Out of the possible combinations of sleaze and GSD, I keep encountering {sleaze} and {sleaze, GSD}. What I'm finding hard to come by, and what I'd kill for in a cofounder is the other: {GSD}. And tbh, I think {sleaze, GSD} is more representative of what people view as an ideal hustler. I can say, with certainty, that I don't want that in a partner.

Re: I don't want a hustler

#12

Post by nupark »

tgriesser wrote: post #3

I will readily take a business-minded, action-oriented cofounder who gets shit done. I have absolutely no interest in a hustler. In my mind, that is the absolute definition of a hustler, someone who will get shit done. Predicating that hustlers are sleazy, or have questionable ethics, or don't value technical skill sets is the same as assuming that "hackers" are people who break into computers. Sure there are probabl…

Your definition of 'hustler' is both valley-centric as well as seemingly predicated on a wink and a nod denial of the sleazy origins of the term.

http://www.google.com/search?sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8&#3...

Re: I don't want a hustler

#13

Post by tgriesser »

ktsmith wrote: post #7
tgriesser wrote: post #3

I will readily take a business-minded, action-oriented cofounder who gets shit done. I have absolutely no interest in a hustler. In my mind, that is the absolute definition of a hustler, someone who will get shit done. Predicating that hustlers are sleazy, or have questionable ethics, or don't value technical skill sets is the same as assuming that "hackers" are people who break into computers. Sure there are probabl…

Hustler both describes enterprising go getters and sleaze ball unscrupulous jerks. The problem is which meaning is more prevalent. I can't think of a single person I would describe with the word hustler and mean it in a positive way. I also wouldn't use the word hacker to refer to myself or any of my respected peers outside of technical circles due to its very negative connotations with non technical folk. While the…

I agree with the assessment that both terms come with such differing meanings, that they should probably be avoided in the mainstream for the fear of losing the point in the technicalities.

What I took issue with is that the post was in direct response to a piece that outlined exactly what the term hustler meant in the positive sense, then went on to say that they wouldn't want one based on the negative meaning, when in reality they just couldn't find a good one to work with.

As the original article from Micah said: A Hustler on the other other hand is a relationship builder. Someone who can build direct relationships with their customers. They arent really promoters, although they do a lot of promotion. They arent salespeople, although they do a lot of selling. They are passion people. They have the ability to articulate their passion clearly and in a way that gets other people equally passionate.

As a technical person who has worked on several projects with someone who I consider to be an "enterprising go getter" and in my mind a hustler, I think that they can often be greatly under appreciated - especially good ones, and this article didn't do anything to convey that respect.

Re: I don't want a hustler

#14

Post by tgriesser »

nupark wrote: post #12
tgriesser wrote: post #3

I will readily take a business-minded, action-oriented cofounder who gets shit done. I have absolutely no interest in a hustler. In my mind, that is the absolute definition of a hustler, someone who will get shit done. Predicating that hustlers are sleazy, or have questionable ethics, or don't value technical skill sets is the same as assuming that "hackers" are people who break into computers. Sure there are probabl…

Your definition of 'hustler' is both valley-centric as well as seemingly predicated on a wink and a nod denial of the sleazy origins of the term. http://www.google.com/search?sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8&#3...

I am only going off the definition which this article is referencing.

http://learntoduck.com/micah/hackers-hustlers

Re: I don't want a hustler

#15

Post by [deleted] »

andrewacove wrote: post #8
pdenya wrote: post #5

Edit title: I want a hustler but can't find one.

Upvoted. As I've often heard people say about good UX designers, "I'd also like a unicorn." Honestly, though, I'm more interested in Hacker/Humanist than Hacker/Hustler. I think a UX person would be a much more valuable partner for me.

[deleted]

Re: I don't want a hustler

#16

Post by nupark »

tgriesser wrote: post #14
nupark wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Your definition of 'hustler' is both valley-centric as well as seemingly predicated on a wink and a nod denial of the sleazy origins of the term. http://www.google.com/search?sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8&#3...

I am only going off the definition which this article is referencing. http://learntoduck.com/micah/hackers-hustlers

Yes, this applies to the original article -- and the minority use of this vernacular in general.

People (like myself, and I believe the original poster) take issue with the use of 'hustler' because we see clear parallels between the negative connotations of the term and those individuals that self-identity with it.

Re: I don't want a hustler

#17

Post by delineal »

I've known a couple of examples. There was the hustler who was booted from his own startup because he was a shallow jerk that no-one wanted to work for. The company is doing very well without him.

Then there was the founder/hustler who made promises to customers without even consulting his development team, despite this repeatedly coming back to bite the company in the rear-end. He's still doing it today.

I think it's great if someone is willing to do whatever it takes to make a deal... but the deal isn't over until the product is in the hands of the customer. When promises are made that can't be kept, it lowers everyone's morale (customers, developers, hustlers, etc). Hustlers need to look at the big picture and understand what the real cost of closing a deal is.

Re: I don't want a hustler

#18

Post by puredemo »

ktsmith wrote: post #7
tgriesser wrote: post #3

I will readily take a business-minded, action-oriented cofounder who gets shit done. I have absolutely no interest in a hustler. In my mind, that is the absolute definition of a hustler, someone who will get shit done. Predicating that hustlers are sleazy, or have questionable ethics, or don't value technical skill sets is the same as assuming that "hackers" are people who break into computers. Sure there are probabl…

Hustler both describes enterprising go getters and sleaze ball unscrupulous jerks. The problem is which meaning is more prevalent. I can't think of a single person I would describe with the word hustler and mean it in a positive way. I also wouldn't use the word hacker to refer to myself or any of my respected peers outside of technical circles due to its very negative connotations with non technical folk. While the…

A little from column A, a little from column B. ;p

Re: I don't want a hustler

#20

Post by funthree »

andrewacove wrote: post #8
pdenya wrote: post #5

Edit title: I want a hustler but can't find one.

Upvoted. As I've often heard people say about good UX designers, "I'd also like a unicorn." Honestly, though, I'm more interested in Hacker/Humanist than Hacker/Hustler. I think a UX person would be a much more valuable partner for me.

I sent you an email.
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