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For black CEOs in Silicon Valley, humiliation is a part of doing business

bloomberg.com

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Re: For black CEOs in Silicon Valley, humiliation is a part of doing business

#491

Post by hayez1 »

cycomanic wrote: post #446

This is somewhat tangential to the article, but I've written about this previously. I think a big first step would be to stop talking about race for different skin colours. I'm always surprised that "race" is so commonly adopted in conversations even by campaigners against racism, as a European I always cringe. The term implies a genetic difference where there isn't any and thus contributes to systematic racism/discr…

There IS a genetic difference between races though.

Diseases cluster in different races. Different races have different phenotypes. Different races have different brain sizes (https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S01602...).

You people are just as bad as the creationists who think the world is 6000 years old. Of course different groups who have been isolated from each other for thousands of years are going to have some micro-evolutionary divergence. THAT IS BASIC EVOLUTIONARY BIOLOGY! If an 8 year old can understand it, why can't you?

Re: For black CEOs in Silicon Valley, humiliation is a part of doing business

#492

Post by math_denial »

remote_phone wrote: post #112
analyst74 wrote: post #102

> the simple phrase ‘Black Lives Matter’ is seen as a political dog whistle, rather than a desperate cry to bring attention to a dire situation that many people choose not to see.” A little off-topic, but I notice a lot of the "All Lives Matter" people are mistaking the term "Black Lives Matter" as valuing black lives over others. I wonder if "Black Lives Matter Too" would convey its message better.

50% of the US has below 100 IQ. There is literally nothing you can do if some people can’t understand the meaning that “Black Lives Matter” doesn’t mean “Only Black Lives Matter”. I think it’s a small but loud percentage of the people believe this.

More than a response this seems a rhetorical fallacy: "If they don't agree with me they're stupid". Maybe some of these people want to resolve racism but disliske the BLM methods? Are they stupid?

Re: For black CEOs in Silicon Valley, humiliation is a part of doing business

#493

Post by watwut »

missedthecue wrote: post #465
zerocrates wrote: post #407

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Class reductionism is basically saying that disparities that appear to be due to race, gender, orientation, etc. are really just economic differences, so if you can "fix" the economic bit the rest just solves itself. The term is, somewhat ironically, often applied in a reductionist manner.

Uh... I think that is more palatable viewpoint than blaming them on genetics

I think that the alternative is supposed to be official policy of pushing some groups away and unconscious racism/sexism.

Re: For black CEOs in Silicon Valley, humiliation is a part of doing business

#494

Post by read_if_gay_ »

dgb23 wrote: post #291
ibudiallo wrote: post #140

I usually choose to believe in "the honest mistake". It happens, two people walk in, one of them is the CEO, you assume it is the one on the right. And then when you realize it is a mistake, you apologize. We are only human. But when it happens over and over and over, you can't help but feel frustrated. You realize that people natural instinct is to think you are the subordinate. One second your are on stage at Techc…

> You wouldn't believe how lonely it is. In my team of 150 people, we were two black people. This is a huge part of the problem isn't it? I believe these painful interactions would be much less common if tech culture were more diverse in the first place. Women share a similar fate. Whenever I hear some of these stories I cringe. Some of them are surprising/shocking even. But this seems important. Hearing those storie…

> This is a huge part of the problem isn't it?

I think this is the problem.

Say a black guy with gold teeth, tons of tattoos and colorful dreadlocks and a middle aged white guy walk in. One of them is a rapper. Who is it?

Based on experience, most people will certainly assume the black guy is. What if it turns out it’s the white guy?

Are they unconsciously racist against white people or are they just following experience-based heuristics? Would they have decided differently if rappers were commonly middle aged white guys?

I say for sure. If black people in tech become more common this particular problem will solve itself.

Re: For black CEOs in Silicon Valley, humiliation is a part of doing business

#495

Post by greenhatglack »

jakelazaroff wrote: post #451
greenhatglack wrote: post #160

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's a lot of money to be made in "anti-racism" and "gender-science", especially in tax-heavy countries. No one ever dares to question it, and it's "good" causes that could use some of the workers income. I'll be contrarian and recommend Thomas Sowell's "Black Rednecks and White Liberals" instead.

> No one ever dares to question it, and it's "good" causes that could use some of the workers income. Questioning those things is basically mainstream conservative discourse. You’re questioning them right now .

Right, the last guy to do that, got fired from Google.

Re: For black CEOs in Silicon Valley, humiliation is a part of doing business

#496

Post by greenhatglack »

MacsHeadroom wrote: post #468
greenhatglack wrote: post #424

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What would convince you otherwise? Like what would suffice in order to convince someone like you that massive sums are spent on this? Should be in relative terms to other aspects, like health care or should it be in absolute values?

Revenue isn't profit. The executive coaching industry is far bigger and it's not remotely a cash cow.

Revenue and profit implies business, I am talking pure funds transferred from taxes. What does that fall under?

Re: For black CEOs in Silicon Valley, humiliation is a part of doing business

#497

Post by chewz »

Couple of years ago me and few other guys (highly qualified and paid SAP engineers all) have been sitting in beer garden in Dusseldorf. The waiter had been friendly and asks:

- Where are you guys from? - From Poland - Oh, you have came here to purchase some old cars, right?

Re: For black CEOs in Silicon Valley, humiliation is a part of doing business

#498

Post by greenhatglack »

eyelidlessness wrote: post #454
greenhatglack wrote: post #419

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not discussing the content, but you picked a 3 minute clip out of a 36 minute long videos as if the clip was pre-made to discredit him, I understand certain people fear a black man with a contrarian point of view as it disturbs their senses, but this is a bit too much.

I didn't even watch the clip, but if a THREE MINUTE clip is discrediting, you're either discredited on your ideas or catastrophically bad at presenting them in the format.

Right, and nothing can be ever taken out of context or edited to fit a narrative in this day and age? Seriously, I have to argue that context is a thing?

Re: For black CEOs in Silicon Valley, humiliation is a part of doing business

#499

Post by brabel »

freddie_mercury wrote: post #386
js2 wrote: post #195

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am Jewish. This gives me no insight into what it is to be black in America. But it does give me some insight into what it is to be a minority in America. I have an inkling of your loneliness and you have my profound sympathy. I wish everyone could experience what it is to be a minority in some, any, aspect of their identity to the extent that it might provide them some empathy for others. (I also never realized wha…

> I wish everyone could experience what it is to be a minority in some, any, aspect of their identity to the extent that it might provide them some empathy for others. You would be surprised at how pervasive and long-lasting majority privilege can be. I live in Southeast Asia where foreigners are a very distinct minority and they experience all kinds of hardships. Difficulties making (local) friends, difficulties dea…

The very fact they find it necessary to use a different word to describe themselves, "expats", than what they call foreigners who live in their countries, "immigrants", shows that they do not at all consider themselves to be in any way similar.

I've lived as part of a minority in other countries for half of my life. I try as much as I can to blend in, not because I think they are superior, but because I want to learn from their culture. But I have no illusion they will ever treat me the same way they treat their own. I can speak the local language perfectly and lots of people will still address me in English (not the local language) just because I look foreign. The locals never invite for anything. It's quite frustrating. I don't even have people from my own culture to socialize with, so I am mostly alone with my wife (who has another culture as well). It's frustrating for sure, but we learn to rely only on our own and enjoy life like that.

Re: For black CEOs in Silicon Valley, humiliation is a part of doing business

#500

Post by watwut »

throwaway_jobs wrote: post #287
2muchcoffeeman wrote: post #253

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I acknowledge racism is a real issue but think it’s reasonable to disagree what the best solution is. This stuff (white fragility etc) just smells way too much like “original sin” and “we are all sinners but must strive towards holiness, however unachievable” to me. I’ve always been a “treat others as you would like to be treated” person. But a lot of this anti-racist concept is appearing on all my pod casts. And n…

> I’m in Australia and I think these are largely US concepts. Based on that statement alone I think I can accurately conclude you are not an indigenous Australian (aboriginal). Seems they share quiet a lot in common with native Americans from stealing of their lands/displacement, mass killings, enslavement By colonists, to ongoing racism that continues to carry on today.

American concepts around these things are not based on native Americans history, but on African American history. It is true that Americans tend to project own culture and history into other groups and then get offended when those tell them "wait our history and prejudices are different".

Even more, Americans assume that sexism elsewhere must be the same as sexism in America. They just seems to be completely confused about other countries having somewhat different gender stereotypes and different expectations on genders. The end result is that local sexism is combined with American version of sexism - end result is not more equality, it is less of it.

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