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After GitHub CEO backs Black Lives Matter, workers demand an end to ICE contract

latimes.com

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Re: After GitHub CEO backs Black Lives Matter, workers demand an end to ICE contract

#201

Post by alex_young »

brabel wrote: post #170
jobeirne wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> But to expect that a _federal agency_ will be denied service from a private entity, especially for essentially political reasons, is lunacy. Um, think you've got this backwards. Private entities shouldn't have to take on anyone they don't want as customers (for whatever reason - do you have to justify who you do or don't want in your livingroom?), but publicly-funded institutions shouldn't be able to deny service o…

I am strongly against a private business being able to refuse service to a person/organization on political grounds, even when the "victim" may seem to be performing evil actions, as long as it is not breaking any laws. One should not discriminate on the basis of race, political orientation, gender, origin or religion. Refusing service is clearly a form of discrimination. When you aim that towards your own Government…

By that same logic corporations should be forced to do business with parts of the government doing things completely in contrition to their mission right? A peace advocacy group would be expected to allow contracts with the military or a right wing think tank would have to sell its services to the Peace Corp?

Re: After GitHub CEO backs Black Lives Matter, workers demand an end to ICE contract

#202

Post by drocer88 »

mchanson wrote: post #60
rattray wrote: post #14

What a bummer that workers are publicly demanding this, and (presumably) seeking press attention on it. I'm no fan of ICE – a very large percentage of my friends in the US are immigrants, and I generally want my country to be a welcoming one. ICE has certainly committed unethical and probably illegal acts (probably true of most federal agencies). But to expect that a _federal agency_ will be denied service from a pri…

Civility has already broken down because of the US government’s actions. Schools and other parts of the government are ending their contracts with police. People all over the country and looking hard at their actions and the actions of those companies or other entities they associate with. When the government is acting this badly the social contract gets weaker and begins to fall apart. This is just a reaction to tho…

Like they it did in 1968. Which gave us Nixon and Reagan.

Re: After GitHub CEO backs Black Lives Matter, workers demand an end to ICE contract

#203

Post by TheAdamAndChe »

Drakim wrote: post #154
TheAdamAndChe wrote: post #104

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Your choice of language by saying "concentration camps" is unproductively hyperbolic and reminiscent of Nazis killing Jews in WW2. People found to have been here illegally are being kept in detention centers until deportation or trial. Nobody is getting gassed or burned in ovens.

He is using the correct definition of concentration camp, you are the one in error. Concentration camps have existed outside Nazi Germany. Just because that was the most horrible instance doesn't mean that other instances stopped being "concentration camps" just like how a particularly horrible murder doesn't make a less violent murder into a non-murder. https://www.britannica.com/topic/concentration-camp

The colloquial definition of the term is different from the technical definition, but they don't even meet the technical definition.

According to your definition, a concentration camp is an "internment centre for political prisoners and members of national or minority groups who are confined for reasons of state security, exploitation, or punishment.."

People of certain minority groups aren't being rounded up. Illegal immigrants are being rounded up, regardless of race or nationality.

I'm not saying whether that's right or wrong, I'm just saying that calling them concentration camps is hyperbolic and uproductive.

Re: After GitHub CEO backs Black Lives Matter, workers demand an end to ICE contract

#204

Post by coffeemaniac »

zdragnar wrote: post #157
drunkpotato wrote: post #89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Demonstrably and rather obviously untrue. They're violating the law in many instances, including but not limited to the cases of asylum seekers and current green card holders; it's just they're following the evil, xenophobic whims of the current political leadership, who are failing to hold themselves or ICE accountable to the rule of law, so they are, for the moment, getting away with their lawlessness. I hope we ca…

Given that the pictures of kids in cages came from before our current president was in office, this is the first time I've heard anyone call president Obama both evil and xenophobic.

Yes, Obama is evil and xenophobic, and a war criminal by every standard. That anyone still listens to him is a testament to how broken our politics are in the US.

Re: After GitHub CEO backs Black Lives Matter, workers demand an end to ICE contract

#205

Post by malandrew »

ckocagil wrote: post #196
jjice wrote: post #175

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not a direct reply to your comment, but more of an adjacent one. > Guess what? Politics are interwoven in every aspect of our lives. You cannot choose to “avoid” them; But I do choose to avoid them in my personal life. A private company can do whatever the hell they want, whether I approve or not, it's their right. I also believe it is my right to not care about politics and continue moving forward with my own life.…

You can ignore politics, but politics will not ignore you. What you're doing is burying your head in the sand, not avoiding.

Not entirely true. The essence of the libertarian platform is a political platform that tries its best to ignore you as an individual and let you be free.

If libertarians were running things, you'd be left not entirely but largely alone.

Re: After GitHub CEO backs Black Lives Matter, workers demand an end to ICE contract

#206

Post by sangnoir »

Fellshard wrote: post #7

Don't feed the political beast, because once fed, it's never enough.

That idea is hasn't been true for decades. You should see how many corps make political donations - what you see is a consequence of 2 things: "Corporations are people (my friend)" and "Citizens United (2010)/Money is free speech". Now that it exists, the question now is who gets control of the corporate megaphone

Re: After GitHub CEO backs Black Lives Matter, workers demand an end to ICE contract

#207

Post by conradev »

mchanson wrote: post #31
johncena33 wrote: post #2

I guess this is the reason lot of corporates try to stay out of politics. Because once you set a precedence then people will use that as to push their own political agendas. I personally don't like the slippery slope argument since it's very lazy and justifies inaction in many cases. But at the same time when I see news like this, I just wonder how long it will take two different subgroups trying push their own confl…

We are going through a very strange and extreme period in US History. Corporations are a huge part of the political landscape. Of course workers who are powerful will demand things of their workplaces. All corporations are political. By accepting the ICE contract previously it was political. Now by reversing they would be changing sides. They were already in the political fray.

Haven't corporations always been a huge part of the political landscape? Lobbying is not a new practice.

Re: After GitHub CEO backs Black Lives Matter, workers demand an end to ICE contract

#208

Post by TedShiller »

I'm part Native American, and while I support BLM, Native Americans are facing the exact same tragic societal problems and discrimination as black people. If GitHub supports BLM they should also support Native American Lives Matter.

Re: After GitHub CEO backs Black Lives Matter, workers demand an end to ICE contract

#209

Post by akerro »

shaggyfrog wrote: post #77

There are a few comments in here already decrying “politicization”. Guess what? Politics are interwoven in every aspect of our lives. You cannot choose to “avoid” them; even suggesting you can be politically neutral is a political stance that comes from a place of privilege, because only the privileged can avoid experiencing negative political consequences inside their bubble. Collaboration with ICE is collaboration…

>Guess what? Politics are interwoven in every aspect of our lives.

Yes, but also companies exist literally only to make money. Companies can't exist without workers. Once a company finds itself in a position of conflict of interest between political views of workers and point of existence of the company - where contracts bring money... we're going to see interesting things.

I wonder, who will break first?

The company will decide it's better to bend to political opinions of employees and end the contract == pay a lot of $money$ for breaking the contract early without delivery and set another precedent where employees decide how and with whom company makes money = uncertain company. Who will make future contracts with such company? Would you outsource your project delivery to a company where employees decide whether your project/office/political stand is good or bad?

Or maybe employees will decide they don't want to work for a company and risk unemployment? Who will risk employing a person who rebels against board members of a company and causes financial damages over broken contract?

I would like to see 100s of GitHub employees leaving GitHub and MS to prove their point, rather than working on the contract, being paid 10x salary of their immigrant desk cleaners and shouting how bad it is the contract exists.

Re: After GitHub CEO backs Black Lives Matter, workers demand an end to ICE contract

#210

Post by duxup »

dastbe wrote: post #57
duxup wrote: post #6

Is GitHub a hug part of what ICE ... does? Personally I wouldn't want to work for a company actually detaining people, but call me terrible but I'm not sure I'd feel the same about letting them pay to host some code...

If your government isn't willing to compromise with you but desires something from you, it's pretty straightforward that you should withhold as much as you can until they decide to compromise.

>If your government isn't willing to compromise with you

I'm not sure I see a reason that the government must compromise with a give company.

If Boeing decided that ICE should behave even worse, would we cheer on ICE for compromising?

I think we'd argue that the right place for that sort of thing is at the ballot box.

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