The American Press Is Destroying Itself • Hacker News Board

Re: The American Press Is Destroying Itself

#131

Post by remote_phone » Sat, Jun 13, 2020, 3:26 PM UTC

wozniacki wrote: post #46

yellowbuilding wrote: post #35

Taibbi is one of the best journalists in America. Very thankful to have people like him doing this.

Entirely removed from the merits and demerits of Taibbi's treatment of the topic at hand, I shudder at your unqualified praise of the man. Without so much as a single source to buttress your point or to qualify how you arrived at that conclusion. Thats like saying Judge Richard Posner is one of the best jurists in the country without adding anything else.[1] [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Richard_Posner

Have you even read any of the other articles he has written? He really is one of the best journalists of this current era, he is truth-seeking instead of motivated by dogma.

Re: The American Press Is Destroying Itself

#132

Post by there_the_and » Sat, Jun 13, 2020, 3:28 PM UTC

CydeWeys wrote: post #117

there_the_and wrote: post #115

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They reported at the beginning of May that subscriptions are at a high: https://www.nytimes.com/2020/05/06/business/media/new-york-t... Scanning the google results for “nyt subscribers” I see them reporting 5 million in Feb and 4.7 million in Aug 2019, so it looks to me like subscriptions have been accelerating in recent months. Can you please share the information you have regarding mass subscription cancellations d…

The op-ed was published on June 3rd.

I’m asking if you could please share links to the information you saw about about the widespread subscription cancellations that you referred to.

Re: The American Press Is Destroying Itself

#133

Post by mushbino » Sat, Jun 13, 2020, 3:28 PM UTC

born_a_skeptic wrote: post #70

34679 wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Morally flexible.

on what?

Racism, xenophobia, healthcare, transphobia, authoritarianism, income inequality, workers rights. Just to name a few.

Re: The American Press Is Destroying Itself

#134

Post by TheAdamAndChe » Sat, Jun 13, 2020, 3:30 PM UTC

For those in the comments that haven't read the article, I highly recommend you check it out. While the comments are talking about the survival of news media and "tone-deaf" titles, the bulk of the article is about the Overton window[1] shifting to the point where rigerous journalism questioning outrages of the time is becoming untenable, weakening the news overall. It's a very good read.

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Overton_window?wprov=sfla1

Re: The American Press Is Destroying Itself

#135

Post by ntsplnkv2 » Sat, Jun 13, 2020, 3:30 PM UTC

ntsplnkv2 wrote: post #26

JPKab wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

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Re: The American Press Is Destroying Itself

#136

Post by humanrebar » Sat, Jun 13, 2020, 3:31 PM UTC

jtbayly wrote: post #94

humanrebar wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It would be hard to argue that a view is universally repugnant when it is espoused by an elected official and there is at least a significant minority of voters polling in support of the view. Given those criteria, we should argue that outright racist or sexist views are both unacceptable and not universally repugnant. I'm still supportive of editors who refuse to publish in those cases. So I'm just quibbling with th…

I mean, I agree, but why be inaccurate with this statement? > significant minority of voters polling in support of the view We know that it’s a majority from the article: > A Morning Consult poll showed 58% of Americans either strongly or somewhat supported the idea of “calling in the U.S. military to supplement city police forces.” Is it because of the same fear that the article is describing in the press?

I wrote "at least a significant minority", which includes majority views.

I was casting a wider net since I think minority views should be discussed, if for no other reason than they should be understood. Disagreeing with someone without even understanding their views is ignorant. Part of the benefit of current protests is catching people up on facts who were previously disengaged.

Re: The American Press Is Destroying Itself

#137

Post by gfodor » Sat, Jun 13, 2020, 3:31 PM UTC

born_a_skeptic wrote: post #52

gfodor wrote: post #42

Taibbi at this point should start a new news co. He, and to some degree, Glenn Greenwald, have been the only two members of the press who seem to be unable to see the emperor’s new clothes in the parades of the last several years.

Why not Tucker Carlson? Just for the record, I subscribe to The Intercept and am a fan of Glenn Greenwald.

Tucker is partisan, and hence corrupted, so regardless of how wrong or right he is on any given issue he isn't someone who could step into the role of a widely-trusted journalist. Taibbi could.

Re: The American Press Is Destroying Itself

#138

Post by eeereerews » Sat, Jun 13, 2020, 3:31 PM UTC

mushbino wrote: post #114

kshatrea wrote: post #103

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am not American and don't live there but have American friends. Most of them anecdotally were happy about the op-ed you mention - they probably aren't members of your political tribe. But then they don't subscribe to the NYT anyway. My point is that the GP is right, this is survival. They tried to be neutral by publishing an op-ed the other side probably liked. Didn't work and therefore it pushes them more into one…

Your American friends were happy about a racist senator saying they should send in the military to kill peaceful protesters? People protesting police violence?

> Those excuses are built on a revolting moral equivalence of rioters and looters to peaceful, law-abiding protesters. A majority who seek to protest peacefully shouldn’t be confused with bands of miscreants.

Re: The American Press Is Destroying Itself

#139

Post by gfodor » Sat, Jun 13, 2020, 3:32 PM UTC

mibbles wrote: post #60

gfodor wrote: post #42

Taibbi at this point should start a new news co. He, and to some degree, Glenn Greenwald, have been the only two members of the press who seem to be unable to see the emperor’s new clothes in the parades of the last several years.

He did this a few years ago, basically in parallel to the Intercept. It didn't work out, and he went back to Rolling Stone afterwards https://theintercept.com/2014/10/30/inside-story-matt-taibbi...

Timing is everything, now's the time.

Re: The American Press Is Destroying Itself

#140

Post by claudeganon » Sat, Jun 13, 2020, 3:32 PM UTC

hedora wrote: post #124

claudeganon wrote: post #76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Most of white American would’ve supported siccing the police and military on the civil rights movement in the 60s. That doesn’t mean that newspapers should’ve advocated they do so. The same holds true here. Ethics are not equivalent to populism.

The newspapers in the 60’s didn’t pretend that 100% of the population was behind the civil rights movement. When racist politicians spoke, they got their platform. People could read, and decide for themselves. If an elected official wants to publish a racist diatribe, the press should circulate it as widely as possible. Informed voters make for a stronger democracy. Burying the editorial because it would offend their…

Ah yes, giving bigotry a prominent position and mass circulation is what protects and furthers democracy. History certainly agrees with your sentiment.