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America is giving up on the pandemic?

theatlantic.com

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Re: America is giving up on the pandemic?

#731

Post by baddox »

rayiner wrote: post #655
baddox wrote: post #616

Earlier quoted context omitted.

According to what definition are you claiming that police brutality is not a public health problem?

Oxford Textbook of Public Health: https://m.oxfordmedicine.com/mobile/view/10.1093/med/9780199... . Do you see any sections on police brutality? Not to mention, I have family in the field, I grew up with probably a dozen public health experts attending Thanksgiving dinner, and did my first internship at a public health company. At no point in hearing decades of shop talk did I ever hear police brutality being mention…

I wouldn’t expect that textbook to list all examples of public health issues, nor would I expect you to overhear discussion about all examples.

Re: America is giving up on the pandemic?

#732

Post by [deleted] »

remote_phone wrote: post #636
vgchh wrote: post #605

Being an American (Naturalized), I am unable to understand where are we headed. It's often said that America always bounces back. That American spirit and innovativeness is unmatched and capable of overcoming any obstacles. However, the current environment feels surreal. We have had the most Covid infections and most deaths in the world. Mass protests against police brutality, being met with more police brutality. Wi…

I think Biden should choose a moderate Republican as his VP. That is the most symbolic choice he could make that he is serious about bringing this country back together. It’s just about the only thing he could do that would unite this country. Going further left will destroy this country, not because I disagree with the policies but because right now we are in a crossroads for this political divisiveness.

[deleted]

Re: America is giving up on the pandemic?

#733

Post by dang »

anticonformist wrote: post #110
thethethethe wrote: post #76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> why were the people protesting the lock downs and business shutdowns and the limiting of freedoms the yahoos and crazy murderers? People denounced those protesters because they were protesting because many of them thought the virus was a hoax or because they couldn’t get a hair cut or buy lawn fertilizer. The current protests are addressing systemic racism black people have faced in America for hundreds of years an…

These protests are going to result in the deaths of thousands of people. They are clearly irresponsible during a pandemic. Gathering in large groups with no physical distancing is tantamount to conspiring to commit mass murder. The problem of racial inequality has existed for "hundreds of years" so why not push the protests back 1 year so it won't unnecessarily cost many people their lives? There is no reasonable sug…

Could you please stop creating accounts for every few comments you post? We ban accounts that do that. This is in the site guidelines: https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html.

You needn't use your real name, of course, but for HN to be a community, users need some identity for other users to relate to. Otherwise we may as well have no usernames and no community, and that would be a different kind of forum. https://hn.algolia.com/?sort=byDate&dateRange=all&type=comme...

Re: America is giving up on the pandemic?

#734

Post by alkibiades »

achenatx wrote: post #294

Just wanted to add that the abolish the police sentiment isnt as inane as it sounds on the surface. Abolish the police is about taking away responsibilities that police have today and giving them to people more suitable. Police - people trained for aggression with weapons to stop violent criminals should not be handling: 1) mental health 2) homeless 3) drug addiction 4) domestic violence 5) traffic stops etc etc They…

then why give it such an inflammatory divisive hateful name?

Re: America is giving up on the pandemic?

#735

Post by razzimatazz »

seles wrote: post #58
SPQT wrote: post #16

Not a surprise, COVID19 is pretty soft compared to the historic pandemics. I'm actually suprised that this continued for so long, I gave the lockdowns 4 week, but I guess the media propaganda blessed it with longer life. Just to clarify about Covid: -The highest deathrate from it is around 1%, CDC reports 0.30 lately. -Hits predominantly the old parts of the population -The death comes in a normal way - pneumonia ->…

Link to source? Current data on cdc is 1,920,904 cases and 109,901 deaths which is 5.7% (and it doesn't appear to be changing much). That's about 20 times higher than your figure of 0.3%.

Just to those who downvote - if someone poses a question or argument which you think is easily refuted, by downvoting or removing that question you remove the opportunity for anyone else with the same argument to learn something.

And maybe this is part of the problem with the whole covid discussion - labeling all these simple arguments from all sides as "wot a moron!" instead of presenting them clearly for people to learn from.

Re: America is giving up on the pandemic?

#736

Post by thisiszilff »

banads wrote: post #619
thisiszilff wrote: post #581

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is important to note that this isn't just about police brutality. There are a number of racial disparities that result in more black deaths. From the letter: > lack people suffer from dramatic health disparities in life expectancy, maternal and infant mortality, chronic medical conditions, and outcomes from acute illnesses like myocardial infarction and sepsis. Biological determinants are insufficient to explain t…

Indeed, white people in the US on average live 3.5 years longer than black people in the US.[1] Did you know that an even greater health/life expectancy disparity exists between men and women? One gender on average lives 5.1 years longer than the other.[2] >decreased access to medical care and healthy food, unsafe working conditions, mass incarceration, exposure to pollution and noise, and the toxic effects of stress…

To be perfectly upfront with my own beliefs, I believe economic disparities is the mother of all other disparities and that many of these statistics that show disparities in outcomes for whites vs blacks are just echos of that economic disparity. That, I think, is the core disparity and the core way in which "the system" oppresses people across generations.

That being said, I don't think gender is a good counterpoint given that biology does have a significant role in some disparities in outcomes for men & women (for example life expectancy). With race, as cited in the letter, biological explanations aren't enough to explain the differences.

> Why is it so popular to talk about these same issues as systemic oppression against group X (relative to group Y), while ignoring or the fact that those same issues affect group XY, often to an even greater degree (relative to group XX)?

Speculatively, with respect to blacks in America, I'm going to guess that it isn't any single issue that is concerning, but the totality of them. Yes, a given issue X might affect group Y more than it does blacks, but blacks in the US as a population are affected by multiple such issues and I can't think of many areas where they have a leg up over other groups.

Re: America is giving up on the pandemic?

#737

Post by alkibiades »

sjg007 wrote: post #719
chasd00 wrote: post #699

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I got very skeptical reading the reaction to the antibody studies here. Also, the total hate for Sweden really depressed me. I've always held this place in high regard but I suppose it's still just more of the same.

The prevalence is too low for the antibody tests to be reliable. Every public health expert has reported that but people refuse to listen. Sweden has admitted their strategy is not working.

i don’t think we’ll know what worked or didn’t for years from now. regardless of what even they say.

it could be we just delayed deaths that will happen eventually anyway while commuting economic seppuku

Re: America is giving up on the pandemic?

#738

Post by claudeganon »

chasd00 wrote: post #699
alkibiades wrote: post #602

Earlier quoted context omitted.

i’m 25 and this whole covid debacle and seeing how public health officials handle it has soured me on all “experts” for the rest of my life. no wonder people don’t believe in global warming, these “experts” prioritize politics over everything

I got very skeptical reading the reaction to the antibody studies here. Also, the total hate for Sweden really depressed me. I've always held this place in high regard but I suppose it's still just more of the same.

I mean, Sweden is fairing badly next to their neighbors, and horrendously compared to countries like Taiwan and South Korea (who also didn’t have lockdowns). I don’t think people hate the country so much as they’re assessing the relative failure of their approach.

Re: America is giving up on the pandemic?

#739

Post by rabuse »

kilo_bravo_3 wrote: post #579
shwoopdiwoop wrote: post #564

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sounds like severely limiting access to guns in the US would be great place to start then.

Shh. Don't say that. The crazies will come out and tell you about if we do that we'll end up a totalitarian wasteland like Sweden or New Zealand or something like that.

It's not crazy to understand that limiting firearm access to law abiding citizens will provide an upper hand to criminals who couldn't care less about breaking laws, with the number of firearms currently in the U.S.

Re: America is giving up on the pandemic?

#740

Post by rabuse »

ken wrote: post #568
jpxw wrote: post #487

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can I see these calculations please?

Black people in America have a measurably lower life expectancy than white people [1]. For people born in 2015, it's down to about 5%, but as recently as 1970, it was over 10%. That's a lot of years of life being cut short. (There are well-known social causes for this which are direct consequences of racism, like access to quality health care, housing, education, credit, etc.) COVID-19 deaths aren't taking nearly tha…

This doesn't factor in diet and lifestyle choices, which have a very dramatic effect on life expectancy.
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