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Uber Eats removes delivery fee for Black-owned restaurants

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Re: Uber Eats removes delivery fee for Black-owned restaurants

#71

Post by wutbrodo »

Nextgrid wrote: post #61
bww wrote: post #32

Setting aside the obvious PR opportunism, how would something like this actually work? Does Uber currently collect data on the race of the people who own restaurants they deliver from? Is data like this publicly available somehow? Is this data something they're going to start collecting to facilitate this feature? Does that sound like data it would be good for Uber to have? Knowing what we know about Uber this all se…

I wonder how this will work from a legal point of view. This is a blatant, obvious example of racism, they aren't even attempting to be subtle about it.

It's effectively affirmative action, and there's a long history of legal apologia for it.

In the final analysis, the law is interpreted by humans, and if a class of violation (like racism) is popular enough, the system finds a way to excuse it with hand-waving.

Re: Uber Eats removes delivery fee for Black-owned restaurants

#72

Post by Orou »

sshumaker wrote: post #40
uniformlyrandom wrote: post #19

That's racist.

A more useful definition from So you want to talk about race: Racism is any prejudice against someone because of their race, when those views are reinforced by systems of power. This definition is useful in the sense that it helps focus efforts on what needs to be addressed - systemic racism - vs trying to convince 100% of individuals to stop being racists in their day-to-day.

> Racism is any prejudice against someone because of their race, when those views are reinforced by systems of power.

The addition of "systems of power" to the definition of racism is a recent one, and it blurs the lines between "racism" and "systemic racism" as separate concepts by introducing power dynamics.

Having clear definitions for abstract concepts is essential for people to understand each other and (hopefully) reach consensus. Redefining words so that they better suit certain ideological perspectives does not help that cause.

It also casually implies that being prejudiced and discriminatory based on skin tone is fine, as long as you're discriminating "up", not "down".

Re: Uber Eats removes delivery fee for Black-owned restaurants

#73

Post by s1artibartfast »

sshumaker wrote: post #40
uniformlyrandom wrote: post #19

That's racist.

A more useful definition from So you want to talk about race: Racism is any prejudice against someone because of their race, when those views are reinforced by systems of power. This definition is useful in the sense that it helps focus efforts on what needs to be addressed - systemic racism - vs trying to convince 100% of individuals to stop being racists in their day-to-day.

This definition is problematic because it denies racism at the individual level if it does not align with institutional racism.

Re: Uber Eats removes delivery fee for Black-owned restaurants

#74

Post by mcculley »

Nextgrid wrote: post #61
bww wrote: post #32

Setting aside the obvious PR opportunism, how would something like this actually work? Does Uber currently collect data on the race of the people who own restaurants they deliver from? Is data like this publicly available somehow? Is this data something they're going to start collecting to facilitate this feature? Does that sound like data it would be good for Uber to have? Knowing what we know about Uber this all se…

I wonder how this will work from a legal point of view. This is a blatant, obvious example of racism, they aren't even attempting to be subtle about it.

In the United States, we have several legal mechanisms for categorizing ownership of businesses, including the SBA 8(a) Business Development program (https://www.sba.gov/category/business-groups/minority-owned) and the SBA Women-Owned Small Business Federal Contracting program (https://www.sba.gov/federal-contracting/contracting-assistan...).

That's just for small businesses in general. When you look at purchasing entities such as the DoD and state governments, there are many such ways to identify ownership as belonging to a disadvantaged population.

Re: Uber Eats removes delivery fee for Black-owned restaurants

#75

Post by mrcorona »

ThrowawayBandit wrote: post #9
lucasyvas wrote: post #2

While a wonderful gesture, something about this feels a bit... tangential to the real issue to me in a way that's distracting. Am I off base here? It feels like it's leaning toward opportunistic.

How is that a wonderful gesture? This is a corporate PR stunt that has nothing to do with anything and that perpetuates racial discrimination. This is awful.

>How is that a wonderful gesture?

There is an economic justice part of US racism that is not addressed enough if at all... Black people have been literally robbed of their income/wealth regularly and often for a few centuries now. If companies want to stand up and try to help repair this lack of justice that we all inadvertantly benefitted from, this is one way to do it.

Just because the government (for at least 100 years) continues to drag its feet when it comes to reparations doesn't mean individual companies can't step up.

Re: Uber Eats removes delivery fee for Black-owned restaurants

#76

Post by throwaay2222 »

jmull wrote: post #69

Comments here show a lot of people don’t really know what racism is. Now is an important time to learn, so please read. Racism if the belief that race is the basis for determining that one group of people is superior to another group. Specifically, it is NOT acknowledging that their are differences in the circumstances and opportunities people have based on race. Nor, necessarily , treating people differently based o…

I believe is immoral to pay someone more or give business advantages to someone based on their race or gender, or any other attribute.

The policy should be more like, if you support black lives matter publicly then we will waive delivery fee.

Re: Uber Eats removes delivery fee for Black-owned restaurants

#77

Post by wutbrodo »

jmull wrote: post #69

Comments here show a lot of people don’t really know what racism is. Now is an important time to learn, so please read. Racism if the belief that race is the basis for determining that one group of people is superior to another group. Specifically, it is NOT acknowledging that their are differences in the circumstances and opportunities people have based on race. Nor, necessarily , treating people differently based o…

While narrowly correct, this barely rises above the level of pedantry. As I'm sure you're aware, racism is in common use as a short form for "racial discrimination", of which this is uncontroversially an example. Unless you object to white nationalist separatists being called racists, on grounds that wanting a separate white homeland doesn't require any belief in racial superiority? (Or the more mundane form, people who want their neighborhoods to be their own race and oppose race-mixing)

This isn't the fact-check "lesson" you think it is; it just pedantic apologia for racial discrimination that shows your own narrow understanding of the situation more than anything else.

Re: Uber Eats removes delivery fee for Black-owned restaurants

#78

Post by mrcorona »

champagneben wrote: post #34
daleharvey wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It seems like you are finding it hard to understand what makes racism systemic, white restaurant owners are not an oppressed group, nobody is being racist against them. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Institutional_racism

Are black restaurant owners an oppressed group?

Black households have about $5000 in wealth. When considering the fact that they are owed 40 acres and a mule in reparations, remember that each black household should be worth upwards of $800,000 (~$20k per acre).

Ask yourself if education, poverty, healthcare, loans, housing, etc... would be an issue if they were actually paid what we all collectively owed them. I expect some portions of the racism would still exist but economic empowerment is always a potential gamechanger.

Seems uber is trying to help fix that gap themselves. I commend them for at least trying something novel.

Re: Uber Eats removes delivery fee for Black-owned restaurants

#79

Post by Scarblac »

Fargren wrote: post #31
newbie578 wrote: post #20

How is this supporting the current situation, when this is a literal example of racism? People don't need or DESERVE special treatment, be it negative or positive, people deserve to be treated as equal. I don't understand why is it so hard to fathom?

The definition of racism is not treating a race different from others. Racism is a belief that one race is better or worse than others, and the politics that arise from that belief. Recognizing that a group has been treated unfairly and compensating for it is not racism.

Strictly speaking racism is the view that different races of human even exist.

Re: Uber Eats removes delivery fee for Black-owned restaurants

#80

Post by CyberDildonics »

It is interesting to see the responses here as opposed to this thread where pointing out that a company having diversity targets means they are explicitly not hiring based on performance (not just measuring who they have hired based on demographics of who has applied, and not mentioning race at all) ends up with multiple people agreeing that I'm a 'racist bad person'

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=23433335

Reverse racism is a dull, simplistic and naive, and implementing it at the business level is illegal and likely unhelpful on a systemic level, not to mention that people don't spend their money based on the demographics of the company who made a product. Race also isn't the only protected class, no one seems to be mentioning women, people closer to retirement age or veterans.

I would be more impressed if uber set up offices in poorer areas regardless of demographics or lobbied for schools to have more uniform funding regardless of their neighborhood. Maybe they could have small business courses at their offices or teach people about car maintenance.

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