631–640 of 835 posts
Disclaimer: I am a bleeding heart liberal and this may filter my observations. I have been to a few rallies/vigils/marches lately and all incidences of violence that I have witnessed either in person or through media has been instigated by the police. As far as I know,every documented case where a formerly peaceful crowd turns into chaos has been started with police shooting pepperspray, teargas, or whatever into the…
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> It's unfortunate that it's gotten to this point for people to take police brutality at least somewhat seriously. They still aren't taking it seriously. People are still bending over backwards to justify violence and police incompetence against even peaceful protestors and press members. They're cheering for people to be run down in the street, etc. Nothing is getting better and things I fear things will only get wo…
I don't know who you are talking about. This isn't meant to be an insult, but I don't know a single person anywhere on the political spectrum that is trying to justify police incompetence and violence. That sounds like a very fringe view. I agree with you in that things probably will only get worse.
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On the topic of police refusing to do their job in order to punish backlash. https://twitter.com/MplsWard3/status/1267891878801915904 > Politicians who cross the MPD find slowdowns in their wards. After the first time I cut money from the proposed police budget, I had an uptick in calls taking forever to get a response, and MPD officers telling business owners to call their councilman about why it took so long.
I have no context on this, but just reading that sentence, why wouldn't a budget cut raise response times? Is there context that suggests they're lying?
Disclaimer: I am a bleeding heart liberal and this may filter my observations. I have been to a few rallies/vigils/marches lately and all incidences of violence that I have witnessed either in person or through media has been instigated by the police. As far as I know,every documented case where a formerly peaceful crowd turns into chaos has been started with police shooting pepperspray, teargas, or whatever into the…
I've had the opposite experience in Chicago. I live in a high rise in the loop. I was able to watch the "protests", "riots", whatever from above. I'm sure I'll get flagged but these are my honest impressions on the behavior of the CPD and the protestors. My biggest takeaway is local events translate to global action in the crowd (police or protestors). And it leads to all this misunderstanding. "What I was just stand…
Police escalate conflict simply by showing up, especially in riot gear.
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No one disagrees that in any group only a small number of bad actors are causing this issue. However, when a civilian acts inappropriately there are legal consequences. When a police office acts inappropriately there are few legal consequences and they are very-very-rarely enforced. I'll ask the question differently, "Is destruction of property what you expect from rioters?" Yes, 1% or less of rioters are going to be…
Aha, but the analogy that you made with those questions has a critical error. The correct analogy would be questions that read: Is destruction of property what you expect from civilians? Yes, sadly, 1% or less[1] of civilians are are going to be stupid and riot instead. And that is unacceptable. Should they be reprimanded? Absolutely. And we have specialized government entities that can utilize appropriate-force to r…
Yes, in almost all but the most extreme of cases. (And the people who make that determination are called "judges" not "cops".)
Should reprimanded cops continue to be cops?
No, in all but the most trivial and excusable cases. (And the people who make that determination should also be called judges not cops.)
If you get given a badge and a gun, and job that demand people to people to respect your authority, you not only get held to a higher standard than those of us without, but you also put your livelihood at stake if you choose to behave in a "stupid or abusive" manner.
It's abundantly clear to people outside the US that the cop who killed George Floyd needs to be fired and prosecuted for murder, the three cops who stood there and let him do it need to be fired and prosecuted for accessory to murder, and those four cops chain of command also needs to be investigated for culpability and almost certainly fired if not prosecuted as well. It seems unbelievable that some US citizens think otherwise. I expect that from cop unions, who've proven themselves time and time again to be completely devoid of humanity or morals, but find it unthinkable that anyone else can't see it clearly as evil thuggery from people who society has to demand better from. All four need to never be in any position of authority again. At least one of them needs to be in jail for life.
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Aha, but the analogy that you made with those questions has a critical error. The correct analogy would be questions that read: Is destruction of property what you expect from civilians? Yes, sadly, 1% or less[1] of civilians are are going to be stupid and riot instead. And that is unacceptable. Should they be reprimanded? Absolutely. And we have specialized government entities that can utilize appropriate-force to r…
From what I can tell your only change was to add the word “unwarranted” before destruction. Could you please help us understand your position on “Should abusive officers be reprimanded?” And if we agree they should be reprimanded, what are your thought on how we build that system? The system where we the civilians who witness or are victims of the abuse and other “good cops” who witness the abuse, can get legal ways…
(He claimed that in the context of property damage, which hides the actual implications of that carelessness, because it wasn't police property damage that triggered this current unrest...)
I _strongly_ disagree. A cop committing assault or murder, while on the job, is a thing society needs to take great care does not happen. It's abhorrent to me to take a "shit happens" attitude to cop killings.
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You understand why US cops are so heavy handed though, right? It may be because they have to deal with a population with 3 guns per capita, where the amount of police killed per year on duty(even disregarding accidents) is more akin to a third world country than anything going on in the EU. > and high level LE people still not accepting any blame I don't know how you get that from OP saying that both sides need to de…
>where the amount of police killed per year on duty(even disregarding accidents) is more akin to a third world country Police mortality isn't any more exceptionally high in a "third world country" than anywhere else. Your view that bad things = third world country, is simplistic. Your attitude is typical of a certain mindset. It's also boring because now I can tell a lot about you and could guess 100% correctly about…
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Stopping traffic risks the lives of people in ambulances so it’s pretty hard to condone that. Make noise, block access to some businesses, etc, but don’t block streets and cause traffic jams that could kill people FFS.
I have never in my life seen an ambulance be stopped by a protest, nor have ever heard of such an incident ever occuring.
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> I would like to invite anyone to define exactly under what conditions people think they have the right to stop traffic at major intersections for hours on end, other than of course signalling to the city beforehand. When peaceful protests have failed to affect change and police brutality (especially for POC) is continuing unabated.
I'll respond to this comment here on behalf of all of the responses to my point: None of you have provided any reasonably objective definition of what could constitute an otherwise illegal, and sometimes violent protest. These responses sound a lot like right-wing NRA 2cnd Amendment people barricading in buildings with guns and police surrounding them kind of rhetoric. All three of the responses (at the time of my re…
By your definition, black people using or destroying a whites-only bathroom as a form of protest would be off limits. I'd recommend some time away from the keyboard and do some reading about protest and the cultural history of same. As a very basic starting point, you might consider reading https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Protest in its entirety.