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Police attacks against journalists across the U.S. since May 28

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Re: Police attacks against journalists across the U.S. since May 28

#371

Post by rpiguy »

bosswipe wrote: post #91

I had been heartened by the right's recent upswing in fierce support for the first amendment, but unfortunately I've seen little of that support during the protests as freedom of assembly and freedom of the press have been attacked. For example Rand Paul has not tweeted in a week. Sadly, as always, these kind of principled arguments, on both sides, are a sham to advance whatever the partisan battle of the week is.

Because rioting isn’t free speech. All conservatives support peaceable assembly and protest. They also fiercely believe in property rights as inherently tied to the concept of liberty. It is right in the Declaration of Independence. No conservative worth his or her salt will defend theft, property destruction, etc.

Re: Police attacks against journalists across the U.S. since May 28

#372

Post by enraged_camel »

rhino369 wrote: post #279
bosswipe wrote: post #177

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But aren't you supposed to defend their right to say it even if you disagree?

A couple points. Sure, but that doesn't extend to rioting and looting. The government has been restricting our first amendment rights to assemble for covid for 3 months. It's illegal to hold church services right now. Are we in a public heath emergency or not?

>>Sure, but that doesn't extend to rioting and looting.

The state (i.e. the police) also don't have the right to murder people without provocation, yet they routinely get away with it. So here we are.

Re: Police attacks against journalists across the U.S. since May 28

#373

Post by TeaDrunk »

DiffEq wrote: post #359
colejohnson66 wrote: post #328

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I can’t respond to your earlier comment: but people aren’t saying he’s a saint; they’re making him a martyr of sorts. He died from police brutality, and instead of trying to fix that (over the past few decades ), the police and President have waged civil war.

Civil War? More blacks are killed by blacks - far more than blacks are killed by police. That is the real civil war. When are black leaders going to address that?

Black leadership has been bombed, assassinated, and jailed. Their neighborhoods are targeted for predatory financial extraction and are disproportionately exposed to environmental hazards like waste processing plants, dumps, etc.

The Black Panther party had significant leadership and unification, social programs like food, educational programs, etc. They were killed. Bombed in fact. Prominent leaders were shot in their beds by the government.

Black Wall Street existed, utterly peacefully in fact, and they were utterly destroyed by white riots.

The black community has tried repeatedly to address things and in every turn they were beaten back down.

What do you recommend?

Re: Police attacks against journalists across the U.S. since May 28

#374

Post by jascii »

DiffEq wrote: post #359
colejohnson66 wrote: post #328

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I can’t respond to your earlier comment: but people aren’t saying he’s a saint; they’re making him a martyr of sorts. He died from police brutality, and instead of trying to fix that (over the past few decades ), the police and President have waged civil war.

Civil War? More blacks are killed by blacks - far more than blacks are killed by police. That is the real civil war. When are black leaders going to address that?

Deflections are not really a productive discussion tool.

That aside, why do you think that is? Could hundreds of years of systemic economic repression have any causual effect on that? Do you have any suggestions how we as society could bring those numbers down?

Lastly, how in bleeps name does that justify police violence?

Re: Police attacks against journalists across the U.S. since May 28

#375

Post by CamperBob2 »

morsch wrote: post #367
CamperBob2 wrote: post #338

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, the police do not have a monopoly on the lawful use of force. Not in the USA... or, at least, not in most areas of the USA. It's ironic that the people trying their best to change that are also the ones who are most closely aligned with the victims of police brutality, politically speaking. One of many things I don't understand.

What are you hinting at? A second amendment thing? Because that really has nothing to do with the monopoly on use of violence. You can be violent without a gun. Who gets to be violent in a legal manner is an orthogonal issue. And how is it ironic? When has the second amendment ever done anything for victims of police brutality? How often has widespread gun ownership been used as an excuse for excessive police force?

The second amendment has everything to do with the question of whether the police (or any other state-sanctioned agency) is entitled to a monopoly on the use of force.

But like I said, I don't understand any of this. Maybe others can offer some insight.

Re: Police attacks against journalists across the U.S. since May 28

#376

Post by chooseaname »

davidw wrote: post #357

It's a pity that some on the left in the past have been so ready with the word 'fascism'. It's a serious word describing a serious problem, and it should not be used casually for "people on the right I disagree with". I believe that the word is appropriate to describe this administration.

At the very least, fascist-like.

Re: Police attacks against journalists across the U.S. since May 28

#377

Post by rpiguy »

nemothekid wrote: post #294
mrfusion wrote: post #261

It seems like in a democracy that voting should be able to effect the changes we need. What has gone wrong?

Are you serious? 1. If that were true women would still be unable to vote. Would you tell women in 1905 that "it's a democracy, you don't need to protest, just vote." 2. Even now, we have seen the power that be make it more and more difficult to vote. The current administration is throwing a complete temper tantrum at even the thought of letting people use absentee ballots during a national pandemic, citing the voter…

Women didn’t shoot cops in the back of the head, burn down city hall, steal and loot stores. These aren’t protests they are riots.

Re: Police attacks against journalists across the U.S. since May 28

#379

Post by SirYandi »

rpiguy wrote: post #377
nemothekid wrote: post #294

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are you serious? 1. If that were true women would still be unable to vote. Would you tell women in 1905 that "it's a democracy, you don't need to protest, just vote." 2. Even now, we have seen the power that be make it more and more difficult to vote. The current administration is throwing a complete temper tantrum at even the thought of letting people use absentee ballots during a national pandemic, citing the voter…

Women didn’t shoot cops in the back of the head, burn down city hall, steal and loot stores. These aren’t protests they are riots.

Protests and riots aren't mutually exclusive

Re: Police attacks against journalists across the U.S. since May 28

#380

Post by jascii »

kortilla wrote: post #360
bradly wrote: post #317

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In a small suburb of San Diego the protest stopped traffic. Police forced the protesters off and then riots started and two banks were burnt down. Two weeks ago a San Diego police deputy was released from jail after serving only six months after sexually assaulting (why forced oral sex is not rape I’m not sure) 16 women that had called the police for help. He does not have to register as a sexual offender. Protesting…

Stopping traffic risks the lives of people in ambulances so it’s pretty hard to condone that. Make noise, block access to some businesses, etc, but don’t block streets and cause traffic jams that could kill people FFS.

I have never in my life seen an ambulance be stopped by a protest, nor have ever heard of such an incident ever occuring.
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