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8GB Raspberry Pi 4 on sale now at $75

raspberrypi.org

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Re: 8GB Raspberry Pi 4 on sale now at $75

#221

Post by bscphil »

phonon wrote: post #217
bscphil wrote: post #121

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My laptop's display panel is almost 10 years old, and has about 96% AdobeRGB coverage. 100% sRGB should be considered barely above shit-tier. Probably fine if you don't do any photo or video editing ever, I guess?

If you're doing photo/video editing for web, sRGB is your target anyway. This is a $530 laptop btw. Which 10 year old laptop had 96% Adobe RGB coverage, out of curiosity?

My screen is the AUO B173HW01 v4, which was shipped with several laptops from that era. The spec [1] was actually finalized in 2009 and that's when my EDID information says the display was manufactured, so "10 years old" was actually a bit conservative it seems.

The spec says it's supposed to have 90% NTSC coverage. I've had it calibrated with a colorimeter, which tells me it has the following properties:

* 89.0% DCI-P3 coverage

* 97.8% AdobeRGB coverage

Here's the graph of its gamut vs sRGB.[2] I edit a lot of photos (though never professionally), and honestly I would never edit on an sRGB screen. Plus, what about HDR video? It's becoming extremely common these days.

[1] http://www.yslcd.com.tw/docs/product/B173HW01%20V.4.pdf

[2] https://cloudflare-ipfs.com/ipfs/Qmaq6553VxMazANuLiFh95aW6fA...

Re: 8GB Raspberry Pi 4 on sale now at $75

#222

Post by phonon »

bscphil wrote: post #221
phonon wrote: post #217

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you're doing photo/video editing for web, sRGB is your target anyway. This is a $530 laptop btw. Which 10 year old laptop had 96% Adobe RGB coverage, out of curiosity?

My screen is the AUO B173HW01 v4, which was shipped with several laptops from that era. The spec [1] was actually finalized in 2009 and that's when my EDID information says the display was manufactured, so "10 years old" was actually a bit conservative it seems. The spec says it's supposed to have 90% NTSC coverage. I've had it calibrated with a colorimeter, which tells me it has the following properties: * 89.0% DCI…

That's a 6-bit TN panel, with a decent gamut. Color accuracy will be so-so, most likely. (What's your delta-E?) Viewing angles are not great either. [1] An 8-bit IPS panel with 100% sRGB would likely be superior for most purposes. It's also a 17.3" screen vs. 13" which was what was being discussed.

I did the photography and color grading for a published coffee table book on a monitor with less than 97% AdobeRGB. I would have liked a better monitor, but it worked out....Lightroom and Photoshop have nice tools to help.

If you're doing HDR video editing, get an HDR display. If you're doing professional video/picture editing, get one with a wide-gamut and good color accuracy. For most people, 100% sRGB will be pleasing and accurate for most purposes.

[1] http://www.panelook.com/B173HW01%20V4_AUO_17.3_LCM_overview_...

Re: 8GB Raspberry Pi 4 on sale now at $75

#223

Post by thetinguy »

_bxg1 wrote: post #199

Something I just thought of: with public schools going full-remote, there are lots of lower-income households whose children are really struggling to stay in the loop. Has anyone thought about starting a program to package up Raspberry PIs with case, cables, installed OS, and a cheap display, and send them to people for quarantine-education purposes?

At that point you can just get chromebook.

Re: 8GB Raspberry Pi 4 on sale now at $75

#224

Post by bscphil »

phonon wrote: post #222
bscphil wrote: post #221

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My screen is the AUO B173HW01 v4, which was shipped with several laptops from that era. The spec [1] was actually finalized in 2009 and that's when my EDID information says the display was manufactured, so "10 years old" was actually a bit conservative it seems. The spec says it's supposed to have 90% NTSC coverage. I've had it calibrated with a colorimeter, which tells me it has the following properties: * 89.0% DCI…

That's a 6-bit TN panel, with a decent gamut. Color accuracy will be so-so, most likely. (What's your delta-E?) Viewing angles are not great either. [1] An 8-bit IPS panel with 100% sRGB would likely be superior for most purposes. It's also a 17.3" screen vs. 13" which was what was being discussed. I did the photography and color grading for a published coffee table book on a monitor with less than 97% AdobeRGB. I wo…

> That's a 6-bit TN panel, with a decent gamut. Color accuracy will be so-so, most likely.

For sure, I grant that there are much much better panels these days. I would get something better if I was purchasing it today. But I would find it difficult to give up the wide gamut with all the work I do with photos (personal and travel photos).

The profile says the white point ΔE 2000 to daylight locus is 21.86. I don't understand exactly what this is, but I know it isn't very good. The viewing angles are indeed quite bad, though actually a bit better than most other TN panels I saw during that era.

My point wasn't that this was the best screen you could get, even at the time, just that an sRGB screen isn't impressive at all - Apple's MacBooks hit 100% sRGB in 2014 at the latest, going by one I profiled with my colorimeter. MacBook Pros have been at ~100% Display-P3 for years now, and HP has a laptop at 100% DCI-P3.

> For most people, 100% sRGB will be pleasing and accurate for most purposes.

I just don't know that this is true. HDR video is becoming a bigger and bigger thing. Image codecs that support 10 bit+ color depth are becoming widespread; the iPhone takes photos with HEIC by default. I assume that eventually consumers are going to want to be able to view movies in HDR on their laptops, if we aren't there already.

Re: 8GB Raspberry Pi 4 on sale now at $75

#225

Post by hipboi »

xvf22 wrote: post #106
Legogris wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Like a Rock Pi 4? https://rockpi.org/rockpi4

Hmm, PoE support on the Rock Pi 4 seems to be a hat just like the rpi 4.

rpi 4 PoE is only 13W, which is not enough for ROCK Pi 4 with SSD, USB3 etc. We have designed the ROCK Pi 23W PoE.

https://wiki.radxa.com/ROCKPI_23W_PoE_HAT

Re: 8GB Raspberry Pi 4 on sale now at $75

#226

Post by finnthehuman »

close04 wrote: post #212
finnthehuman wrote: post #184

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's just like the keyboard in a sense. Before the keyboard problems were a wildly-acknowledged issue I had to listen to people online argue that the field failure rate was perfectly fine, when they didn't know either the actual failure rate nor know anything about reliability engineering. Maybe the failure rate is fine, maybe it's not. All we know right now is that they added an additional single point of failure. T…

> Maybe the failure rate is fine, maybe it's not. Maybe you're right, maybe you're wrong. I can just pick the second option. This is like digging up an old comment and saying "it's like when you were wrong that time". > All we know right now is that they added an additional single point of failure. Do we know that? TPM and encryption are also single points of failure, for your data at least. Apple didn't add that to…

>I can just pick the second option.

Sure. I prefer to live in the possibility space of uncertainty. Until something comes along to reduce that uncertainty.

>TPM and encryption are also single points of failure, for your data at least

Indeed they are.

>Apple didn't add that to increase the failure rate,

That's never the goal, but every design decision shifts the likelihood of certain failure types up and down. As I said before, the best case scenario is that Apple ran the math/experimentation to quantity it and was happy with their balance of likelihood of various failures.

You can argue until you're blue in the face Apple chose well. That's fine, doesn't mean someone who is close to the pain of end users experiencing failure is acting in bad faith by disagreeing with you.

Your last paragraph is just an ends justify the engineering-means argument. I don't find those interesting anymore.

Re: 8GB Raspberry Pi 4 on sale now at $75

#227

Post by close04 »

finnthehuman wrote: post #226
close04 wrote: post #212

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Maybe the failure rate is fine, maybe it's not. Maybe you're right, maybe you're wrong. I can just pick the second option. This is like digging up an old comment and saying "it's like when you were wrong that time". > All we know right now is that they added an additional single point of failure. Do we know that? TPM and encryption are also single points of failure, for your data at least. Apple didn't add that to…

>I can just pick the second option. Sure. I prefer to live in the possibility space of uncertainty. Until something comes along to reduce that uncertainty. >TPM and encryption are also single points of failure, for your data at least Indeed they are. >Apple didn't add that to increase the failure rate, That's never the goal, but every design decision shifts the likelihood of certain failure types up and down. As I sa…

> You can argue until you're blue in the face [...] doesn't mean someone who is close to the pain of end users experiencing failure is acting in bad faith by disagreeing with you

Since you didn't actually provide any evidence either way (and nobody did to my knowledge) it stands to reason that indeed your only point is to argue.

There's no reason to assume Apple introduced something like the T2 chip for any other reason than to offer genuinely useful features to users and profit from it. Genuine criticism should be based on more than "maybe I'm right, maybe I'm wrong". Otherwise it's just shilling. ...And losing an argument, whether you found it interesting or not.

Care to see how others read your "brilliant" maybe this, maybe that "argument"? All manufacturers should offer no features to have no point of failure. Any single addition to any product can only be another point that can fail. Thus it should be assumed by default that this must be the intention of every manufacturer. It even begs the conclusion that all of them are the same so singling one out is purely grudge based.

Re: 8GB Raspberry Pi 4 on sale now at $75

#228

Post by phonon »

bscphil wrote: post #224
phonon wrote: post #222

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's a 6-bit TN panel, with a decent gamut. Color accuracy will be so-so, most likely. (What's your delta-E?) Viewing angles are not great either. [1] An 8-bit IPS panel with 100% sRGB would likely be superior for most purposes. It's also a 17.3" screen vs. 13" which was what was being discussed. I did the photography and color grading for a published coffee table book on a monitor with less than 97% AdobeRGB. I wo…

> That's a 6-bit TN panel, with a decent gamut. Color accuracy will be so-so, most likely. For sure, I grant that there are much much better panels these days. I would get something better if I was purchasing it today. But I would find it difficult to give up the wide gamut with all the work I do with photos (personal and travel photos). The profile says the white point ΔE 2000 to daylight locus is 21.86. I don't und…

ΔE 21.86 isn't just "not very good", it's unusable for color work. (I would call it "shit-tier", in your parlance). Why did you even use a colorimeter and not calibrate? Sorry to say, that's a much bigger issue than being able to show more intense greens. You're just wrong. Someone asking for a "good screen" should be entirely satisfied with a screen with 100% sRGB gamut, a good ΔE ((And yes, sure go get a laptop with 100% DCI-P3, HDR 600, etc. I'll wait...)

Re: 8GB Raspberry Pi 4 on sale now at $75

#229

Post by uHuge »

rewoi wrote: post #68
uHuge wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why not have Linux directly on your Android? There are great options and the VNC works reliably.

I want local machine, so remote VNC is out. There is no Linux like solution for android phone that runs Xserver and OpenJDK reliably. Samsung DEX emulation was the only usable solution, but that was killed off. Termux can not run OpenJDK, some weird issues with crashing. Also most devices do not have enough cooling capacity, max performance can be only delivered in short bursts before CPU gets throttled down. If you…

Termux -> proot Arch -> pacman -S jre-openjdk

When you want Xserver, you just do so from Android vnc viewer to 127.0.0.1:5901 or so.

Re: 8GB Raspberry Pi 4 on sale now at $75

#230

Post by youngtaff »

hipboi wrote: post #220
youngtaff wrote: post #117

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Unfortunately POE is still external on the Rock Pi 4 A carrier board for Compute Module with just POE / ethernet, USB ports and and SD card slot would be good enough too I literally want same form factor as the Ubiquiti board but with open source support, and sufficient power to charge a phone from the USB port Orange Pi Zero is along the right lines but doesn't have enough RAM for my needs and I'm unsure about the p…

This is Tom Cubie, the founder of ROCK Pi. If you want small form factor, we have ROCK Pi S for you. Checkout: https://wiki.radxa.com/Rockpis

Thanks but that doesn't have enough RAM for me or POE

Basically want something like https://fccid.io/SWX-UCCK/Internal-Photos/Internal-Photos-36...

I network / POE port, 1 or 2 USB sockets to plug a phone into, SD-Card slot, 1GB+ RAM, A53 (or above) processor

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