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The Day AppGet Died

keivan.io

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Re: The Day AppGet Died

#41

Post by colejohnson66 »

solarkraft wrote: post #14
banana_giraffe wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I doubt it. I've hinted at in comments here in the past, but I have one such story. It's a footnote, at best, in MS's history, and a thing for a now-dead product, but they turned what I thought was a cool product into their own thing then disappeared it through internal MS politics. I don't tell the story in any details since I don't want those details getting back to the real me and having a negative impact on my ca…

How could a gigantic corporation stealing your idea be seen as negative?

The word “stealing” is a big hint

Re: The Day AppGet Died

#42

Post by pavlov »

yjftsjthsd-h wrote: post #38
pavlov wrote: post #12

The story reminds me of Andy Hertzfeld’s Switcher: https://www.folklore.org/StoryView.py?project=Macintosh&stor... The difference is that, in 1984, Bill Gates immediately offered $40k and Steve Jobs offered $100k for plugging a hole in their operating system. In 2020, Microsoft just strings you along on vague promises while they simultaneously rip you off.

I love how those stories of the early years are so different from what I think of looking at companies today - > Jeff picked me up at the airport, and we drove to Microsoft's main building where we were joined by Neil Konzen, a talented 23 year old who was Microsoft's main systems programmer on the Macintosh. I knew Neil from his days as an early Apple II hobbyist, when we collaborated on adding features to an assemb…

Microsoft is still the largest Mac software vendor, and they are again in the Unix distribution business with WSL. The more things change, I guess...?

Re: The Day AppGet Died

#43

Post by zitterbewegung »

yjftsjthsd-h wrote: post #38
pavlov wrote: post #12

The story reminds me of Andy Hertzfeld’s Switcher: https://www.folklore.org/StoryView.py?project=Macintosh&stor... The difference is that, in 1984, Bill Gates immediately offered $40k and Steve Jobs offered $100k for plugging a hole in their operating system. In 2020, Microsoft just strings you along on vague promises while they simultaneously rip you off.

I love how those stories of the early years are so different from what I think of looking at companies today - > Jeff picked me up at the airport, and we drove to Microsoft's main building where we were joined by Neil Konzen, a talented 23 year old who was Microsoft's main systems programmer on the Macintosh. I knew Neil from his days as an early Apple II hobbyist, when we collaborated on adding features to an assemb…

You do realize that Microsoft Word has been on the Mac since 1985 suite and even the first Microsoft Flight Simulator was on the Apple II?

Also Applesoft basic was derived from Microsoft basic?

Yes, they did copy the operating system but that doesn't mean that the Mac Platform is unimportant to them.

Re: The Day AppGet Died

#44

Post by marcinzm »

WesolyKubeczek wrote: post #33

1. Release some code under a permissive license 2. Start complaining when companies exercise precisely the rights you have given them

The fact that you’re allowed to do something doesn’t mean you’re not a dick for doing so. Nor does it mean you can’t be called out for being a dick.

Re: The Day AppGet Died

#45

Post by lostmsu »

colejohnson66 wrote: post #37
lostmsu wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That would not have helped MongoDB. I considered their new license, but it seemed tailored to their specifics. So maybe more research is required. Perhaps a variant of CC-BY NC would be better, but it is not tailored to code.

What’s wrong with AGPL?

AFAIK AGPL permits linking without disclosing linked code like LGPL does. Meaning they can still distribute it as their own, train models and serve them with a simpler framework. Just can't build services powered directly by it.

Re: The Day AppGet Died

#47

Post by lame88 »

Fuck anyone callous enough to take something as far as an onsite trip with the pretense of a job and then just ghost them. I can't think of a much clearer way to show that much disrespect of someone and their time. And that's just the tip of the iceberg in this case. Remember things like this whenever you see the "microsoft <3 linux" slogan and the rest of the PR facade people are all too willing to swallow.

Re: The Day AppGet Died

#48

Post by ASalazarMX »

na85 wrote: post #20
Wowfunhappy wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't know the details of your project, but what if you open sourced under the GPL? I feels as though the world has soured on the GPL in recent years, but whenever I see this type of sentiment—that open sourcing work is just a gift from small developers to big tech companies, or something thereabouts—I think, wouldn't the GPL solve that problem? Sure, big companies can still use GPL'd code, but they're forced to gi…

By Eben Moglen's own admission[0], the GPL has never been successfully enforced in a court of law, even against criminal infringers. It seems toothless to me. A relic from a byegone era when companies cared about ethical behavior. [0] https://www.gnu.org/philosophy/enforcing-gpl.html

Ahem https://www.gnu.org/philosophy/enforcing-gpl.html

Re: The Day AppGet Died

#49

Post by intern4tional »

ak39 wrote: post #7

Man, this hurt to read. Keivan’s response is the right one. But I wonder if the arrangements and outcome would have been different had AppGet been closed source. This is just not cricket from team Microsoft.

This isn't secret news, but when you interview at MS there is always a secret / hidden interviewer. This is publicly known information from Cracking the Coding interview. This person is called the as appropriate and you only meet them if you pass all the prior interviews.

Per his writeup, he did not meet that person, which means that he most likely did not pass the interview.

He also for some reason didn't follow up on the results of the interview for 6 months, which is unique as most candidates will reach out. Assuming he actually filled out a job requisition, which he probably did to interview, he also should have gotten status from that requisition, so things are a little fishy.

I do not know anything about his case directly, but I would bet that he did not pass the interview and a decision was made to not bring him on as a result.

If Microsoft was trolling him to just pick his brain, they would have done more than two small events, and wouldn't have bothered to reach out to tell him they were releasing a product.

This response also burns any bridges that he had built with the team. He could have still potentially made something of his product if he had kept that relationship open and used his leverage as an existing package manager owner to influence WinGet.

If I was him, I would have at a minimum asked for feedback far earlier than wait for 6 months.

Re: The Day AppGet Died

#50

Post by willcipriano »

FridgeSeal wrote: post #30
benatkin wrote: post #24

I don't want to support this company. What are good alternatives to GitHub, TypeScript, npm, and Visual Studio Code (besides Atom)?

>GitHub Github I guess? > TypeScript, npm, I don't know if you'll be able to avoid NPM, but _maybe_ you could try ReasonML if you're doing frontend stuff with TS? Don't really know tbh > Visual Studio Code (besides Atom)? Sublime Text 3 with plugins for general stuff, one of the JetBrains IDE's for more language specific work if so desired.

+1 for jetbrains. I prefer webstorm to visual studio myself and the licensing scheme is very fair.
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