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China’s Communist Party and Its American Media Enablers

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Re: China’s Communist Party and Its American Media Enablers

#21

Post by AnthonyMouse »

misja111 wrote: post #20
AnthonyMouse wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Who's disconnecting everyone? Have we observed Brazil doing this sort of thing at the same level as China? Australia? Nigeria? Canada? Anyone else other than China?

How about the USA's most valuable ally, Saudi Arabia? Anyway, I think many countries would want to do the same as China but they just don't have the leverage to do so.

> Anyway, I think many countries would want to do the same as China but they just don't have the leverage to do so.

But that's the point. It's the reason Saudi Arabia doesn't count. It only matters if they're doing it and are a large enough market to affect the international market. Nobody's changing their movies to capture the 0.4% of the world population that lives in Saudi Arabia.

Re: China’s Communist Party and Its American Media Enablers

#22

Post by jimmaswell »

nxc18 wrote: post #12

It’s so exhausting having to live through this ridiculous propaganda war. Everyone seems to suck here, but there’s so much finger pointing. The people on the US side of the isle seem to be especially frantic now that it’s abundantly clear they dropped the ball about 100,000 times (underestimate) and trashed their economy in the process. Can we stop pointing fingers and just take a break ffs? Everything China does the…

I feel like I'm in the Twilight zone seeing these kinds of equivalencies made online. "China does organ harvesting and brutally supresses the entire populace's rights and did Tiananman Square and arrests and interrogates you for criticizing the police but we had internment camps in WW2 so look in a mirror and stop talking about China" ..no, I'm not going to "stop roasting" China just because my country, like every country, has an imperfect past. At best that's a defense mechanism to feel smug about being silent on crimes against humanity.

Criticize the American covid response all you want but spreading this false equivalence that sounds deep unless you think about it is outright dangerous and a shameful disservice to the citizens of Hong Kong and everyone else impacted by the Chinese government.

Re: China’s Communist Party and Its American Media Enablers

#23

Post by jillesvangurp »

The premise of this article is that the US is the victim of Chinese incompetency. The opening sentence more or less tries to state that as a fact. Basically, the authors are parroting Trump here.

The reality is that Wuhan has been open for business again for two months or so after China dealt swiftly and efficiently with the pandemic while the US was still in denial about having a crisis while at the same time experiencing the crippling effects on the economy. If you want to use the word incompetence in relation to this pandemic, there's no need to look beyond Washington.

This article is the Republican narrative that this thing that happened on their watch isn't their fault at all because evil foreigners tricked them. It's a blatant deflection of any form of responsibility.

Like most of the world, the US was getting all the signals that bad shit was going down late last year, early confirmations that it was going to be really bad in January, and the rest is just plain incompetent governance, opportunistic posturing by populist morons, wishful thinking, and a generally unprecedented level of ineptness throughout layers of government that Republicans have had no small part in helping to deconstruct in the last decades. If you want to point fingers, use a mirror.

Re: China’s Communist Party and Its American Media Enablers

#24

Post by jimmaswell »

nxc18 wrote: post #17
nickff wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Tempora mutantur, nos et mutamur in illis... More to the point, you're engaging in whataboutism, and the fact that one group acted poorly a few generations ago does not excuse current behaviour by another group.

The internment camps are still in living memory fwiw. I don’t know if it’s whataboutism so much as recognizing that China is back to business and the US really isn’t, China published the genetic sequence and made substantial contributions to fighting the disease while the CDC was busy producing faulty test kits, and the US has been systematically undermining the global health system while trying to put blame on the W…

> better job than the US at taking care of it’s people (except minorities, but the US isn’t exactly a model there either).

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/1989_Tiananmen_Square_protes...

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_rights_in_China

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/world/china-forcefully-harvests...

What is America doing to minorities that tops all of this?

Re: China’s Communist Party and Its American Media Enablers

#25

Post by Barrin92 »

creato wrote: post #19
Barrin92 wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>It's part of the reason why Hollywood movies have devolved into such pablum--you can't risk pissing of China now that 1/2 of your income is due to the Chinese release. You also could never afford to piss America off, which is why every other protagonist in hollywood movies is some Tom Cruise lookalike who combats people who speak English in a broken Russian accent. Just seems normal to me, the only difference is tha…

> Just seems normal to me, the only difference is that the other 95% of the world population now have enough cash to vote with their wallets and American companies learn what it's like to operate in a world where different cultures have different values. This is not Chinese citizens "voting with their wallets", it's the Chinese dictatorship dictating what is allowed to be shown in the country. One unilateral vote. Th…

>, yet we (well, at least you) accept it from China. Why?

because it's not my job to tell China how to run their country. This is mostly a distinction without a difference anyway because the Chinese would obviously not enjoy watching a lot of movies in which they're the bad guy and Captain America saves the day.

It's like if you make a movie that insults the Prophet Muhammad a lot of Muslims won't like it, and neither will a bunch of autocratic governments, but it doesn't really make much difference in practice. If one of said countries was on their way to become the world's largest economy that'd probably be reflected in film production over time.

The real issue here is that global consumption now more closely reflects the actual demographics of the globalised economy, which means if producers want to serve all those markets they'll have to be more sensitive to different audiences or regulations.

It's like French radio stations demanding that a quarter of all lyrics be in French. If that was a 20 trillion dollar economy you bet a lot of musicians would make more French songs

Re: China’s Communist Party and Its American Media Enablers

#26

Post by nxc18 »

jimmaswell wrote: post #22
nxc18 wrote: post #12

It’s so exhausting having to live through this ridiculous propaganda war. Everyone seems to suck here, but there’s so much finger pointing. The people on the US side of the isle seem to be especially frantic now that it’s abundantly clear they dropped the ball about 100,000 times (underestimate) and trashed their economy in the process. Can we stop pointing fingers and just take a break ffs? Everything China does the…

I feel like I'm in the Twilight zone seeing these kinds of equivalencies made online. "China does organ harvesting and brutally supresses the entire populace's rights and did Tiananman Square and arrests and interrogates you for criticizing the police but we had internment camps in WW2 so look in a mirror and stop talking about China" ..no, I'm not going to "stop roasting" China just because my country, like every co…

Yeah, there’s lots of bad on both sides.

Here in the US we have crimes like Driving While Black. There was just a high profile execution the other day that made headlines, but most fly under the radar.

We also just killed 100,000 people, minimum, through deliberate incompetence, so there’s that. Technically it’s the past, but in practical terms it’s the present. I’ll remind you that Tiananmen Square was quite a while ago.

Rights are relative, people in China don’t have them, people in the US kind of have them sometimes, assuming they’re the right color or have enough money. In broad strokes it’s better in the US, for now.

I personally like to count the foreign deaths and foreign intervention when evaluating countries-the US really likes interfering with our neighbors, and kills lots of people in the Middle East - 200,000+ innocent civilians. But they’re foreign, so they’re not really people, right? https://theintercept.com/2018/11/19/civilian-casualties-us-w... I won’t even begin with the non-lethal interventions, or more subtle interventions like giving arms to authoritarian regimes and/or terrorists.

But I guess China spies, so that’s really bad. It would be terrible if they stole the NSA’s idea and interfered with network equipment. They do like stealing IP. https://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2014/05/photos-of-an-nsa...

The US does a disservice to the world by not being better in the present. We can’t hold China accountable when we don’t hold ourselves accountable.

Re: China’s Communist Party and Its American Media Enablers

#27

Post by [deleted] »

jimmaswell wrote: post #22
nxc18 wrote: post #12

It’s so exhausting having to live through this ridiculous propaganda war. Everyone seems to suck here, but there’s so much finger pointing. The people on the US side of the isle seem to be especially frantic now that it’s abundantly clear they dropped the ball about 100,000 times (underestimate) and trashed their economy in the process. Can we stop pointing fingers and just take a break ffs? Everything China does the…

I feel like I'm in the Twilight zone seeing these kinds of equivalencies made online. "China does organ harvesting and brutally supresses the entire populace's rights and did Tiananman Square and arrests and interrogates you for criticizing the police but we had internment camps in WW2 so look in a mirror and stop talking about China" ..no, I'm not going to "stop roasting" China just because my country, like every co…

[deleted]

Re: China’s Communist Party and Its American Media Enablers

#28

Post by myopenid »

rmrfstar wrote: post #18
bsder wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Otherwise I think there's a lot of confusion in the article between the conflation of the private market changing products to be popular in China, which is fine and simply reflects their status as a consumer I, personally, have a problem with this. It's part of the reason why Hollywood movies have devolved into such pablum--you can't risk pissing of China now that 1/2 of your income is due to the Chinese release. I…

There's a monopoly angle here too [1]. I remember doing a face-palm when I watched "Gravity." The whole conflict centers around a cascade of space-junk caused by Russia shooting it's own spy satellite. In the movie, the Chinese space station saves the day. In reality, China actually shot down it's own satellite, rendering it's orbit and adjacent orbits unusable for the foreseeable future. [3] I'm all for internationa…

Lol. American movies also tend to romanticize the wars they wage.

Re: China’s Communist Party and Its American Media Enablers

#29

Post by myopenid »

woutr_be wrote: post #14
Barrin92 wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>It's part of the reason why Hollywood movies have devolved into such pablum--you can't risk pissing of China now that 1/2 of your income is due to the Chinese release. You also could never afford to piss America off, which is why every other protagonist in hollywood movies is some Tom Cruise lookalike who combats people who speak English in a broken Russian accent. Just seems normal to me, the only difference is tha…

> You also could never afford to piss America off, which is why every other protagonist in hollywood movies is some Tom Cruise lookalike who combats people who speak English in a broken Russian accent. This is different tho. You can produce a movie that pisses off people, and still have it play in theatres. If you make a movie that pisses of the Chinese government, not necessarily the people, then that movie won't ev…

China pissed off the US so much they blacklisted Huawei, and threatens anyone working with it.

Re: China’s Communist Party and Its American Media Enablers

#30

Post by rmrfstar »

myopenid wrote: post #28
rmrfstar wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's a monopoly angle here too [1]. I remember doing a face-palm when I watched "Gravity." The whole conflict centers around a cascade of space-junk caused by Russia shooting it's own spy satellite. In the movie, the Chinese space station saves the day. In reality, China actually shot down it's own satellite, rendering it's orbit and adjacent orbits unusable for the foreseeable future. [3] I'm all for internationa…

Lol. American movies also tend to romanticize the wars they wage.

Moxie gave a nice talk about American action movies [1].

[1] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tOMiAeRwpPA

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