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Why is AI so useless for business?

mebassett.info

11–20 of 391 posts

Re: Why is AI so useless for business?

#11
post #4

In my opinion, most of the issues leading about AI "failing" in traditional organizations are due to the following: (1) Inflated expectations from higher/middle management which trickle down the organization. AI is seen as a high-profile case which has to lead to success (and a larger budget next year for my dept.) (2) Data quality issues. The data itself has issues, but the key issue is lack of metadata and disperse…

I pretty much agree with all of your points, but I also think there may be a more fundamental issue at play here. ML doesn't actually "understand" things - it can do very sophisticated and accurate pattern matching without actually "knowing" the logic of the patterns it's matching.

This in turn means that it may fail catastrophically when faced with adversarial examples or with examples that are drawn from a different distribution than that of the training set.

Re: Why is AI so useless for business?

#12
post #4

In my opinion, most of the issues leading about AI "failing" in traditional organizations are due to the following: (1) Inflated expectations from higher/middle management which trickle down the organization. AI is seen as a high-profile case which has to lead to success (and a larger budget next year for my dept.) (2) Data quality issues. The data itself has issues, but the key issue is lack of metadata and disperse…

[deleted]

Re: Why is AI so useless for business?

#13

> why can't it read a PDF document and transform it into a machine-readable format? > why can't I get a computer to translate my colleague's financial spreadsheet into the format my SAP software wants? Because you probably expect it to be 100% or maybe 99.999% accurate, and we can't do that. Imagine "AI" translating someones financial spreadsheet into a different format and dropping a zero somewhere. Oops.. but your…

Exactly this. The unreasonable expectations of what AI can do - whilst it can speed things up significantly, majority of cases, you can never fully automate everything with AI.

Re: Why is AI so useless for business?

#14
post #6

The article is just vaguely complaining about undefined problems which makes it very difficult to defend or argue against. Are we talking about ML? Optimization problems? Operational research in general? Automation? And which tasks in which businesses? There's tonnes of useful stuff in each of those categories and vaguely saying that it's all useless doesn't get you anywhere.

Seems pretty exclusively focused on ml

Re: Why is AI so useless for business?

#15

> why can't it read a PDF document and transform it into a machine-readable format? > why can't I get a computer to translate my colleague's financial spreadsheet into the format my SAP software wants? Because you probably expect it to be 100% or maybe 99.999% accurate, and we can't do that. Imagine "AI" translating someones financial spreadsheet into a different format and dropping a zero somewhere. Oops.. but your…

Why exactly do you need an AI that reads a PDF ? Unless you’re dealing with ancient data wouldn’t it be easier to have whatever that’s generating the PDF return machine readable data ?

This suggests to me that lot of office jobs will be lost just by modernizing systems and making them spit out JSON

Re: Why is AI so useless for business?

#16
Our immediate goal should be to set our sights lower; forget ML, instead improve and expand technologies like RPA (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robotic_process_automation), which is only "AI" in the narrowest sense.

Example: my wife is an admin in a school office, and a ludicrous amount of her and her colleagues' time is spent on replicating data entry between a multiplicity of different incompatible systems. The Rolls Royce / engineer's solution to this would be to provide APIs for all these disparate systems and have some orchestration propagating the data between them, except of course that's never going to be remotely practical; instead, dumbly spoofing the typing that the workers do into the existing UIs is a far more tractable approach. My (admittedly not 1st person based) experience of these things is that they currently still require significant technical input in the form of programming and "training", but this fruit has got to be hanging a lot lower than any ML-based approach.

Re: Why is AI so useless for business?

#17
I'm at a hospital where someone at long last got authorized to try ML on the clinical database.

The ethical committee required that prior to using any data, you have to make a static copy in another database. Their argument is

1. They don't want excel files flying around (which will happen regardless) and

2. To perform any analysis, you "obviously" have to have "structured data", which "obviously" means that you have to extract a csv from the base system (MongoDB) and put that into a RDBMS (redcap).

Go figure...

Re: Why is AI so useless for business?

#18
I’ve been working in the “real world business processes that companies are trying to AI-ify” realm for quite a while now. Pharma, cyber security, oil and gas production, etc.

This article doesn’t mention a really, really straightforward factor for why AI hasn’t invaded these domains despite billions of dollars being dumped into them.

An automated process only has to be wrong once to compel human operators to double or triple check every other result it gives. This immediately destroys the upside as now you’re 1) doing the process manually anyway and 2) fighting the automated system in order to do so.

99% isn’t good enough for truly critical applications, especially when you don’t know for sure that it’s actually 99%; there’s no way to detect which 1% might be wrong; there’s no real path to 100%; and critically: there’s no one to hold responsible for getting it wrong.

Re: Why is AI so useless for business?

#19

In my opinion, it's because business operations isn't that complicated and people don't know what AI is. By "not that complicated", I mean a decent CRM system to track information about the organization is approaching peak operational efficiency for most businesses. Most inefficiency I see after that is people/political problems. By "people don't know what AI is", I mean that business owners are unable to describe th…

"AI is a 'brain' that you plop down in the organization and it does 'unsupervised learning' to automate your business and delight your clients with optimized outcomes." - As explained to me

I now see Google sales dragging these people out to 'AI meetings', which are about Dialog Flow. (Meeting pitch email gets around, business manager reply all: 'WTF is this?') Later they summarized the meeting, as they understood it: "You just need to drag and drop the CRM on the 'Brain' and then you can book haircut appointments and open a bank account. We were like um, we develop and support software, they were like - just drag and drop you knowledge management API on it too." Uh... what KM system?

The complicated part is that in small and midmarket business, their knowledge is tribal and processes are folklore. There are processes that are followed though they don't exist, and business rules violated as they aren't aware.

Meanwhile, no one in sales puts useful information in a CRM system if they can avoid it, the least effort principle on administrivia is important if you are ever going to hit your ever growing number.

Finally, the management must still be spooging for SPOGs, I sill see marketing for them as some sort of nirvana. Meanwhile, they have been collecting data randomly about everything, all over the place, excel documents, FTP servers, and of course databases. Here, no one in IS/IT will admit: The servers were here when they started their job and they have no idea what is on them or if they are even needed anymore. They certainly aren't mentioning that to the incoming CIO, who gets focused on improving efficiency as per his executive mandate. So he/she gets to work with cloud migrations (more hilarity ensues)

I need to stop now. It's a rat hole...

Re: Why is AI so useless for business?

#20
> why can't it read a PDF document and transform it into a machine-readable format?

It can definitely do that, but you might not like the cost/benefit analysis, depending on how many such documents you want to process. The costs are coming down steadily though as the tech improves. If you need to do millions of such documents, yeah a model will probably be worth it. But if you need to do a few hundred you probably should just do them manually.

The thing is, reality has surprisingly high resolution. When you give out a task like this to a person, they will likely come back to you for clarification about how you want to deal with some of the examples. Your initial requirements will be underspecified, or incorrect, in some details. When you are dealing with a person, these minor adjustments are pretty inconsequential, and so you don't really notice it happening. The worker might also have enough context to guess what you want and not ask, and just tell you the summary when they deliver the work.

If you're training a model, you need to work through all these annoying details about what you want, just as you would when you're creating any other sort of program. This adds some overhead, and places a lower bound on how many examples you'll need to have annotated -- you'll always need enough examples of annotation to actually specify your requirements, including various corner-cases. You need enough contact with the data to realise which of your initial expectations about the task were wrong.

So there will always be a lower scaling limit, where the automation isn't worthwhile for some small volume of work. The threshold is getting lower but there will always be a trade-off.

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