Live data from Hacker News

TikTok has recently traded at valuations of $105-110B on private markets

bloomberg.com

131–140 of 156 posts

Re: TikTok has recently traded at valuations of $105-110B on private markets

#131

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Soon Tiktok will be banned in the US by an act proposed by FB lobbyists. Smart for them to hire an American CEO, though. But I still believe FB has more lobbyists. Another possible outcome is they will be forced to sell TikTok to some holding companies in the US.

What's the worst that can happen? China banning US services seems to have worked out just fine for their tech industry, so maybe more countries should do that, not fewer.

I've been saying this myself for a while now. Take the EU for example. Why doesn't the EU have a silicon valley rivaling our silicon valley? They have a larger population and a larger economy. Not only can they afford to invest in their silicon valley, they have a market to sustain it. Where is their facebook, google, apple, youtube, etc? Even more baffling is india. The US has a lot of indian tech workers. Why doesn't india bring some home and build their own tech giants. Instead their major "tech" companies are outsourcing companies which essentially "sells" indian workers all over the world. Why not use those workers to build indian tech companies? Why isn't there an indian whatsapp? Why did india hand that market over to facebook? None of this makes any sense.

If they don't want to follow the "chinese model" because of any perceived stigma attached to it, then follow our model. The US became an economic powerhouse due to protectionism. Every major economy in the world developed under protectionism.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Protectionism_in_the_United_St...

I used to think it was because politicians are old and think tech is magic, but I'm just starting to believe most of them are outright lazy and incompetent.

Re: TikTok has recently traded at valuations of $105-110B on private markets

#133

Earlier quoted context omitted.

ByteDance isn't just TikTok, which is what the headline doesn't include. They also own Toutiao (Chinese news/content platform, top 100 website in China), Helo (Indian social media, the Google Play app alone has 2.2M reviews), Lark ( https://www.larksuite.com/ , an enterprise collaboration platform aimed at the Japanese market).

ByteDance did $20bn of revenue in 2019. The comments in this thread are… wow. Lots of opinions from my favourite HN cameo character, "Person With Vitally Important Opinions About Complex Topic But No Time To Read Beyond The Headline."

Nice! My usual trick for estimating a companies value is to multiply it's revenue by 10.

I highly doubt it's operating hosts are eating into the revenue that much so I'd say they're highly undervalued.

Re: TikTok has recently traded at valuations of $105-110B on private markets

#134
post #5

I really can't fathom how this is possible. The largely young demographic (which I'm guessing warrants this valuation) has a track record of jumping from platform to platform, whichever is trendy for a given year. With that in mind, how are investors seriously willing to get behind this company in such a big way?

Yeah I wonder about this too. This time last year (or was it the year before that?) it was Snapchat (remember Snapchat? Kids don't) that was going to take over the world and be bigger than Apple + Facebook + Google combined etc etc. I don't think that worked out really. I am guessing that investors just pile in wherever the "youth" are without paying too much attention to what it really is they are investing in... ju…

Ironically I just took a look at Snap and out of five consecutive advertisements, four were for Tiktok.

Re: TikTok has recently traded at valuations of $105-110B on private markets

#135
post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is an excellent question, but more pertinent is the fact that these companies are state-sponsored, state-backed. The CCP/China views these apps as a serious tool of foreign policy and economic expansion, influence and control. Imagine if Trump had meetings with Apple CEO and was subsidizing their product, creating worker legislation for them, directing/requiring banks to fund them, using the foreign service to h…

> It's a serious issue that 'old economy' Trump is nowhere close to understanding. Politics aside Trump is the first US President to stand up to China. The question is will US corporations do the same?

US Corporations do not have the power to 'stand up to China'.

People need to start to understand that when it comes to major international players, over $50B, that are related to state actors - then it's a geopolitical question as much as an economic one.

TikTok is not just a company, it's a strategic arm of the Chinese government.

China 'divides and conquers' and pushes ruthlessly on any and all entities in pursuit of its goals. They coordinate student groups on Western Uni campuses to oversee Chinese students, suppress any ideas or policies in their way. They threaten any politician, and the press from publishing or making statements they're not happy with.

They use the 'carrot' of access to their huge market, but often this is a ruse - as they require foreign companies to hand over IP to local companies, this IP filters into the hands of state-backed competitors and the entrant never has an opportunity. All of this is in blatant contradiction to WTO terms.

The Western companies that have made inroads are ones that have a lot of brand value, think McDonald's or Disney, but even then, China can have leverage: Big Hollywood films are made for global audiences, and China is a big market over which the government censors and controls content. China dictate terms to major Hollywood studios - and said studios comply - or are banned. It's that simple.

"If you do not promote our policies, and portray China a certain way, you do not get access to our market. So here is how you are going to portray us: ..."

Only the US President or the leader of the EU with the backing of the German Chancellor has the hope of applying pressure on China in any serious way. The Europeans won't so it's down to the US president.

Trump is blustering, nationalist, and not quite focused on the right things in 'standing up to China' and I think he might be doing it for some of the wrong reasons, nevertheless, he is doing it, and actually it is working. He has mostly a competent team doing it.

China's tactics have made a lot of talk behind closed doors around the world and even Dems, Europeans - everyone - is actually happy about this.

Sadly, it may be that the next administration may not have the wherewithal to continue to push for better terms because it does require a fairly steadfast and aggressive approach inconsistent with the personal manner of say, a guy like Obama, whom I admire quite a lot, but who I don't think will do what is needed.

Assume that anything you say on Zoom or TikTok could be made available fairly readily to the Chinese government and that they will leverage control of TikTok for whatever reason they want, consistent with their overall geopolitical strategy.

Re: TikTok has recently traded at valuations of $105-110B on private markets

#136
post #135

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It's a serious issue that 'old economy' Trump is nowhere close to understanding. Politics aside Trump is the first US President to stand up to China. The question is will US corporations do the same?

US Corporations do not have the power to 'stand up to China'. People need to start to understand that when it comes to major international players, over $50B, that are related to state actors - then it's a geopolitical question as much as an economic one. TikTok is not just a company, it's a strategic arm of the Chinese government. China 'divides and conquers' and pushes ruthlessly on any and all entities in pursuit…

> Assume that anything you say on Zoom or TikTok could be made available fairly readily to the Chinese government and that they will leverage control of TikTok for whatever reason they want, consistent with their overall geopolitical strategy.

Don’t have to assume. It is made

Re: TikTok has recently traded at valuations of $105-110B on private markets

#137

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah I wonder about this too. This time last year (or was it the year before that?) it was Snapchat (remember Snapchat? Kids don't) that was going to take over the world and be bigger than Apple + Facebook + Google combined etc etc. I don't think that worked out really. I am guessing that investors just pile in wherever the "youth" are without paying too much attention to what it really is they are investing in... ju…

Snapchat is still massive and influential. My snapchat username is still probably the first thing people my age will ask me for. Yes of course it’s not as influential as facebook or google, since it only has one product, but don’t act like youth no longer use snapchat. Source: I’m youth

It's mostly a US centric thing though

Re: TikTok has recently traded at valuations of $105-110B on private markets

#138

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In my opinion Tiktok is a viable replacement for Instagram, a platform that generates on the order of 10B USD revenue a year. They both have pub/sub models where you can follow topics or celebrities or content creators you care about. Instagram is more photo focused and Tiktok is more video focused. The video first format is arguably higher fidelity/more compelling for content consumers. Yes, people jump from platfor…

I have been watching white people hired by chinese marketing firms on tiktok. It's hilarious. https://youtu.be/xZ3RbDTc_fY https://youtu.be/Mrx4ld3hmmw https://youtu.be/VC-6zkDewBQ

https://youtu.be/xZ3RbDTc_fY?t=200

"This isn't even my real hair color!"

You don't say. Holy hell, this is scary.

Re: TikTok has recently traded at valuations of $105-110B on private markets

#139

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Snapchat is fun. If you're not on it, it's hard to understand.

X is fun for the next 4 days. If you're not on it, you're uncool and don't jump on whatever is popular because it's popular. X = Email# IRC# ICQ AIM Yahoo Messenger Friendster MSN Messenger MySpace Flickr Orkut Google Talk Skype Google Wave Facebook Youtube# Twitter# Vimeo# G+ WhatsApp Periscope Vine Instagram Snapchat TikTok Zoom # Only exceptions, so far

Tumblr, Discord, Slack, Ello, Telegram, Badoo, FormSpring, iTunes Ping, FriendFeed, Diaspora, Bebo, Path, Meerkat, VK, Google Buzz, CryptoKitties... The list goes on and on.

Re: TikTok has recently traded at valuations of $105-110B on private markets

#140
post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

TikTok is fun. If you're not on it, it's hard to understand.

I tried it multiple times, but I've always got low-quality-video fatigue when after have seen the same dance moves 20 times by different people for the same music. With Youtube I can watch conference videos that contain genuinely new content forever, but I don't see that happening with TikTok. Also it spams my mobile notifications, so I had to delete it, even though I don't delete too many apps. For young people who…

Repetition paired with a slight twist is much more addictive than novel content. See: memes, pop music, MCU, etc.
Post reply on HN