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The effects on cognition of sleeping 4 hours per night for 12-14 days

guzey.com

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Re: The effects on cognition of sleeping 4 hours per night for 12-14 days

#231

Post by mannanj »

shijie wrote: post #186
spacephysics wrote: post #160

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Going on 3 years now, with comprehensive blood tests taken every 3-4 months for 2 years. Never had better markers for inflammation (below error threshold), cardiac health, liver health, etc. Tried keto (proper), vegan, vegetarian, low-FODMAP, paleo, all without success. Found a forum of other IBS people, and decided to risk going against mainstream 'authority' such as the American Heart Association. So far, feel bett…

Do you eat nose-to-tail? I hear a lot about people’s carnivore diets and they sound mostly like an “animal flesh diet,” which is lacking in myriad key micronutrients. It seems one would absolutely need to supplement animal flesh with kidney, liver, heart, etc... I’m curious to hear your experience.

Not OP but I've been doing carnivore as well for the last year, and I don't eat across the board. I generally eat Ribeyes and can share a lot of the same benefits he's mentioned. Red meat in particular actually has a fair amount of the vitamins you need such as vitamin-c and the less you cook it the more they're preserved which is why I go on the rarer side of things.

Re: The effects on cognition of sleeping 4 hours per night for 12-14 days

#232

Post by PakG1 »

wayoutthere wrote: post #185
hawkice wrote: post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is by far the most important thing for HN to learn about this. The default level of self deception on this front is enormous.

I think the other part to remember is that the author of the article is 22. I didn't need sleep either when I was his age. I don't mean he's naive, just that a 22-year-old can abuse their body without too many negative consequences. As someone in my late 30s, I definitely feel it when I only get 4 hours of sleep.

Yup. Also in late 30s, and damn. I used to pull off all-nighters no problem in my 20s. Last night, I needed to do some work that didn't get done before, and by 2am, I was falling asleep in front of my keyboard. Ah, naivete of the young. :)

Re: The effects on cognition of sleeping 4 hours per night for 12-14 days

#233

Post by guzey »

jrootabega wrote: post #5

> However, for the entire duration of the experiment I had to resist regular urges to sleep and on several occasions when I did not want to play video games was very close to failing the experiment, having at one point fallen asleep in my chair and being awakened a few minutes later by my wife. I don't really believe this, and I find this interesting and impressive,but this sounds like a George Costanza scheme after…

I'm not sure why you don't really believe this. I didn't really have to mention this, did I?..

Re: The effects on cognition of sleeping 4 hours per night for 12-14 days

#234

Post by guzey »

cco wrote: post #190

This should contain a big fat caveat, this appears to be a very young person, maybe early 20's based on photos? My friend group could pull all nighters and 3-4 am weeknights playing beer pong just fine in college. When we have done so sparingly in our 30's the next day is completely shot so far as productivity, we can operate but at greatly diminished capacity. I'd love to see the author try again in 10 years, I love…

>This should contain a big fat caveat, this appears to be a very young person, maybe early 20's based on photos?

The second sentence of the abstract:

>I’m a 22-year-old male and normally I sleep 7-8 hours.

Re: The effects on cognition of sleeping 4 hours per night for 12-14 days

#235

Post by guzey »

riazrizvi wrote: post #174

I find the cognitive tests in the experiment to be insufficient, to make the argument that practical cognition did not suffer and that the experimenter was 'productive for 16 hours'. The experiment uses two computer games and a 3 hr test, not much of a comparison to all day non-stop creative software development. The SAT is one neat little question after another, every challenge carefully crafted and nicely wrapped.…

I don't know about chess but I coded a lot during the experiment (on day 7 I spent 11 hours coding, starting with a big block between 8am and 2pm) and felt great.

Re: The effects on cognition of sleeping 4 hours per night for 12-14 days

#236

Post by PakG1 »

3fe9a03ccd14ca5 wrote: post #230
hashmal wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I find that my cognitive abilities (i.e. what I am capable of doing) does not seem to significantly decline It's very common. Studies on sleep deprivation report that subjects do not feel their cognitive abilities decline. However, measuring cognition using objective tests does show a significant decrease in these abilities.

Reminds me of people I’ve encountered who think they’re better at X while on $DRUG. Almost for sure, in my experience with these people, it’s definitely not true, though they’re convinced of it. People driving while high are especially frustrating, because they’ve convinced themselves that there better drivers.

People who think they're right when they're wrong are frustrating for anything. Try talking with conspiracy theorists about the science behind vaccines and COVID-19 these days? I have. I'm apparently a sheep that easily trusts the mainstream media and will probably be first in line to kill myself when vaccines become publicly available, only so that Bill Gates and Anthony Fauci can become richer.

Re: The effects on cognition of sleeping 4 hours per night for 12-14 days

#237

Post by lemming »

guzey wrote: post #227
lemming wrote: post #223

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, I saw that following links from this thread, and have spent more of the morning than I should have reading it and the various threads discussing it. I think the criticism seems valid, and it probably means I shouldn't use the book as a reply to people asking for scientific evidence (like the comment I replied to). That said, I don't think it detracts from the main argument of the book, or the main revelation for…

>It single handedly moved getting enough sleep from a similar category to “I should probably eat less salt” to “this is the single most important thing for my health” for me. >That said, I don't think it detracts from the main argument of the book, or the main revelation for me, which is that most people don't realise how damaging lack of sleep is. I don't get this. You find that the book you believe provides the arg…

Well, I wouldn't use the word "bullshit" to describe the book.

Reading (most of) the book caused me to change my priorities from basically "I don't care about how much sleep I get" to "getting enough sleep is an important priority for me". Presumably you would agree that that is a positive effect.

Re: The effects on cognition of sleeping 4 hours per night for 12-14 days

#238

Post by KMag »

dionidium wrote: post #144
hashmal wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I find that my cognitive abilities (i.e. what I am capable of doing) does not seem to significantly decline It's very common. Studies on sleep deprivation report that subjects do not feel their cognitive abilities decline. However, measuring cognition using objective tests does show a significant decrease in these abilities.

See also: "I'm better at pool after 3 beers." Yeah, no you're not.

I used to be on my local pub's darts league team. When I was first playing, objectively, my best accuracy was after 3-4 pints. A couple years in, my best accuracy was after about a pint and a half. The effect was most noticeable with the "Around the World" game we used for practice, as Around the World forces you to keep throwing the darts at one number until you hit that number. Other games, such as 601, 301, and Cricket give you points for hitting things you're not aiming at, so inaccuracy is more hidden in those games.

I suspect part of it was state-dependent practice. I'd practice throwing darts in a bar, much of the practice was after drinking several pints, so I practised my release timing with alcohol.

I also suspect that part of it was the muscle relaxant effect of a moderate amount of alcohol probably does help improve the consistency of motion in releasing the dart.

Re: The effects on cognition of sleeping 4 hours per night for 12-14 days

#239

Post by fiblye »

hombre_fatal wrote: post #196
dionidium wrote: post #144

Earlier quoted context omitted.

See also: "I'm better at pool after 3 beers." Yeah, no you're not.

A few beers makes you better at anything hindered by anxiety. For many people, that's playing pool at the bar in front of others. Or speaking a foreign language. Or holding conversation.

I think a beer can help with anxiety. A few beers just results in overconfidence.

I will admit it helps with conversation if you don’t normally talk and you’re around equally drunk people, but a few beers plus a crowd of sober people doesn’t work as well as most people think it does.

Re: The effects on cognition of sleeping 4 hours per night for 12-14 days

#240

Post by guzey »

karpierz wrote: post #28

It seems like the author tested rote activities that were well within their comfort zone; I'd be curious to see how well they'd perform when trying to learn something new or work at something that they hadn't practiced before.

I hope to test skill acquisition during the next experiment!
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