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Termux and Android 10

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Re: Termux and Android 10

#21

Post by [deleted] »

dueF7un3 wrote: post #18
asveikau wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think it's very alarmist or an overstatement though. An android 10 app is no longer allowed to do what termux does. I guess with more reading they are saying they need to declare themselves as targeting android 9 or lower until they find a solution. At some point, I imagine, that will not be an option. To some degree it should also be on Google to ensure that tightening security (or perceived tightening of se…

I'm confused, because I use termux on android-10 (on a pixel2) without any problem. I have a cron running on it that mails my notifications to me, a ssh server which my laptop use to send my backups on my phone, a go http server running a local app that I use in the mobile's browser, I'll often take screenshots on the phone, then scp them on the laptop, etc. Am I missing something? EDIT: I won't reply to each of you…

[deleted]

Re: Termux and Android 10

#22

Post by gst »

dueF7un3 wrote: post #18
asveikau wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think it's very alarmist or an overstatement though. An android 10 app is no longer allowed to do what termux does. I guess with more reading they are saying they need to declare themselves as targeting android 9 or lower until they find a solution. At some point, I imagine, that will not be an option. To some degree it should also be on Google to ensure that tightening security (or perceived tightening of se…

I'm confused, because I use termux on android-10 (on a pixel2) without any problem. I have a cron running on it that mails my notifications to me, a ssh server which my laptop use to send my backups on my phone, a go http server running a local app that I use in the mobile's browser, I'll often take screenshots on the phone, then scp them on the laptop, etc. Am I missing something? EDIT: I won't reply to each of you…

> I'm confused, because I use termux on android-10 (on a pixel2) without any problem.

It's only an issue if applications target Android 10 APIs. Termux still targets an older API version and is thus not yet affected by this issue. Eventually they'll need to target a newer version because the Google Play store specifies a minimum API version that applications need to use.

Re: Termux and Android 10

#23

Post by tdeck »

dueF7un3 wrote: post #18
asveikau wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think it's very alarmist or an overstatement though. An android 10 app is no longer allowed to do what termux does. I guess with more reading they are saying they need to declare themselves as targeting android 9 or lower until they find a solution. At some point, I imagine, that will not be an option. To some degree it should also be on Google to ensure that tightening security (or perceived tightening of se…

I'm confused, because I use termux on android-10 (on a pixel2) without any problem. I have a cron running on it that mails my notifications to me, a ssh server which my laptop use to send my backups on my phone, a go http server running a local app that I use in the mobile's browser, I'll often take screenshots on the phone, then scp them on the laptop, etc. Am I missing something? EDIT: I won't reply to each of you…

Android apps specify a target SDK version (essentially a kind of OS version) in their manifest alongside a min SDK version. The advantage of targeting a newer SDK than the oldest one you support is that you get access to new APIs, but it often comes with additional restrictions as well. Google Play periodically updates their policy to require that targetSdkVersion be above a certain value in order for an app to be published in the play store (currently that value corresponds to Android 9) [1]. What this means is that this policy is an optional trade-off today but likely to be a requirement in the future.

[1]: https://developer.android.com/distribute/best-practices/deve...

Re: Termux and Android 10

#24

Post by cthaeh »

sosborn wrote: post #7
pathartl wrote: post #4

I'm really starting to despise most OS's for having such an overbearing security policy. I think it's really why I've stuck with Windows for so long. For sure Windows is not as user-stupid as something like macOS, iOS, Android, etc... but for me as a power user it's just about as powerful as I need to be. I'm not even considering *nix distros here because honestly the market for every day users for something like Ubu…

> No, I do not want to open system preferences every time I want to launch something. I am a power user. You don't have to. Right click on the icon and select 'open.' https://support.apple.com/en-gu/guide/mac-help/mh40616/10.15...

That is like 3 steps more than it should be. There should be a global setting to tell apple to fuck off with their security bullshit.

Re: Termux and Android 10

#25

Post by asveikau »

dueF7un3 wrote: post #18
asveikau wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think it's very alarmist or an overstatement though. An android 10 app is no longer allowed to do what termux does. I guess with more reading they are saying they need to declare themselves as targeting android 9 or lower until they find a solution. At some point, I imagine, that will not be an option. To some degree it should also be on Google to ensure that tightening security (or perceived tightening of se…

I'm confused, because I use termux on android-10 (on a pixel2) without any problem. I have a cron running on it that mails my notifications to me, a ssh server which my laptop use to send my backups on my phone, a go http server running a local app that I use in the mobile's browser, I'll often take screenshots on the phone, then scp them on the laptop, etc. Am I missing something? EDIT: I won't reply to each of you…

You are running in a compatibility mode. If they built it declaring support for Android 10 at build time it would be subject to the new rules and break.

Long term, I can only assume targeting an old SDK will not be supported at some point.

Re: Termux and Android 10

#26

Post by AgloeDreams »

tmpz22 wrote: post #17
sxp wrote: post #13

I really hope they figure out a good solution for this problem. One way I distinguish between a "real" computer and a toy or appliance is whether you can use the device to write software for it. With Termux, you can write Linux-style programs on the Android device itself or even build full Android apks. One of the other awesome things about Termux is that you can use it to setup a pretty complete ARM Linux environmen…

Tablet companies really need to realize that a decent tablet with a decent dev experience is going to lead to an explosion of developers on their platform and result directly in way higher quality apps and therefore way better sales and brand. Imagine if websites couldn’t be developed on normal desktop computers and you had to run an extremely inefficient emulator every time you wanted to make a small notification.

That would be ChromeOS tablets. Full linux terminal in container and all. Hasn't really made any difference.

Re: Termux and Android 10

#28

Post by xoa »

pathartl wrote: post #4

I'm really starting to despise most OS's for having such an overbearing security policy. I think it's really why I've stuck with Windows for so long. For sure Windows is not as user-stupid as something like macOS, iOS, Android, etc... but for me as a power user it's just about as powerful as I need to be. I'm not even considering *nix distros here because honestly the market for every day users for something like Ubu…

>I hate that macOS is starting to go the iOS route of only letting me run applications that are Apple certified. No, I do not want to open system preferences every time I want to launch something. I am a power user.

Yeah, such a power user that you can't use any one of the easy, documented ways to deal with that? You're not exactly helping your case here.

>Put it behind some shell command or something... but have it easily documented and marketed towards people like me.

  sudo spctl --master-disable
Man page for spctl is all there. Or how about quarantine? That's just controlled by an extended attribute (com.apple.quarantine) and you can remove it (interactively or via script including recursively down a directory tree) with xattr. Want to totally disable SIP too? That's also documented and there, boot to recovery, pull up the terminal and

  csrutil disable
With SIP off you can also then modify what it applies to in a more fine grained way if you want.

Yeah, Apple has put up more guardrails in macOS. But contrary to your assertion, enhanced security is plenty useful for "power users" too. Being a power user doesn't mean that it's nice to have some bad software clobber your install or a zero-day nail you. Some of the new security features could definitely be made much more easily useful for power users sure, up to and including having a GUI on them. It'd be nice if Apple had functionality to easily have your own root signing setup alongside theirs, so that we could take advantage of all the signing mojo as well. And it's reasonable long term to be concerned about a day when Macs also have hardware trust chains and what happens then.

But for the time being macOS remains 100% modifiable for an actual genuine power user. The new stuff can be turned off, and more easily arguably then back when you needed to recompile your own kernel to mess with kern.securelevel and the like. Somehow someone in the company continues to open source a certain amount of macOS same as the old days, see https://opensource.apple.com/.

Re: Termux and Android 10

#29

Post by adrianmonk »

dueF7un3 wrote: post #18
asveikau wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think it's very alarmist or an overstatement though. An android 10 app is no longer allowed to do what termux does. I guess with more reading they are saying they need to declare themselves as targeting android 9 or lower until they find a solution. At some point, I imagine, that will not be an option. To some degree it should also be on Google to ensure that tightening security (or perceived tightening of se…

I'm confused, because I use termux on android-10 (on a pixel2) without any problem. I have a cron running on it that mails my notifications to me, a ssh server which my laptop use to send my backups on my phone, a go http server running a local app that I use in the mobile's browser, I'll often take screenshots on the phone, then scp them on the laptop, etc. Am I missing something? EDIT: I won't reply to each of you…

Android apps ship with a file called AndroidManifest.xml that (among other things) tells the operating system the latest version of the API that the app understands, i.e. what the app was compiled and tested against. The operating system tries to maintain backward compatibility with what the app is expecting.

The Termux maintainers have built their app to tell the operating system that Termux is only aware of how the Android 9 API works. So when you run Termux on your Android 10 device, the operating system tries to behave like it's Android 9. So it allows this.

They (Google) do this to ease the transition so that when a new version of Android is released, they don't force all developers everywhere to immediately fix all compatibility issues.

But they do want developers to do it eventually, so at some point in the future, they will probably stop allowing the Termux maintainers to upload an app that declares "I don't understand Android 10 yet".

Re: Termux and Android 10

#30

Post by envy2 »

cthaeh wrote: post #24
sosborn wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> No, I do not want to open system preferences every time I want to launch something. I am a power user. You don't have to. Right click on the icon and select 'open.' https://support.apple.com/en-gu/guide/mac-help/mh40616/10.15...

That is like 3 steps more than it should be. There should be a global setting to tell apple to fuck off with their security bullshit.

There is:

  sudo spctl --master-disable
Then choose "Anywhere" under "Allow apps from..." in the Security & Privacy preferences. You'll never be bothered again.
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