An Airbnb for farmland hits a snag, as farmers raise data privacy concerns • Hacker News Board

Re: An Airbnb for farmland hits a snag, as farmers raise data privacy concerns

#71

Post by tzs » Sun, May 17, 2020, 2:07 PM UTC

aguyfromnb wrote: post #53

lucb1e wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

With formatting: """ 1. Climate Corp was part of Monsanto before it became Bayer. It was acquired by Monsanto. 2. John Deere wanted to buy Climate as well as Monsanto but that was struck down by US courts and Bayer bought Monsanto. 3. What was Climate Corp doing before? They had something called Field View where they charged farmers to collect and collate data. 4. All precision Ag, Ag robotics and farm data collectio…

> There won’t be any more farmers in the future but only farming corporations. Is this any different than, "pretty soon there won't be any local movie rental places (or retail places), it'll just be content delivery corporations"? I do share concerns about this kind of movement, and think it needs to be done judiciously, in every industry. However, I do not agree that just because you're "small" or "independent" you…

> Is this any different than, "pretty soon there won't be any local movie rental places (or retail places), it'll just be content delivery corporations"?

BTW, there is still one Blockbuster open [1].

[1] https://www.vice.com/en_us/article/n7wwnq/the-worlds-last-bl...

Re: An Airbnb for farmland hits a snag, as farmers raise data privacy concerns

#72

Post by Finnucane » Sun, May 17, 2020, 2:10 PM UTC

yalogin wrote: post #11

If the farmers have decades long relationship with the landowners this looks like a power play by tillable/VCs to get in there and take a recurring cut. They know the farmers have no option but to rent land and the VCs know it. So they are using their money to pay cash to landowners and get them on the site. Probability wise there is a 90% chance that the land will be rented by the same farmer as before because of la…

Yeah, they quote Parker Smith saying they’re making connections that wouldn’t otherwise happen, but that’s obviously a lie. The farmers don’t need a ‘market maker’ if they’re already renting land from landlords they know. And it’s not like they can move operations around randomly, like an apartment or hotel room.

Re: An Airbnb for farmland hits a snag, as farmers raise data privacy concerns

#73

Post by dd36 » Sun, May 17, 2020, 2:11 PM UTC

derekbreden wrote: post #43

tsimionescu wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm guessing commodity crops in this context may refer to non-food crops, like corn for bio-ethanol, rapeseed, cotton, tobacco?

That was close to my guess, the only small difference is I would add some maybe-ends-up-in-food-eventually crops as well. My family would refer to the roundup ready corn and soybeans we sold to the grain co-op as commodities, while the small sub-acreage of sweet corn grown to sell at the farmer’s market might be much more likely to be referred to as food. Food being a perhaps overly generous word for partially hydrog…

So, sprayed with more bug poison?

I wonder if this disconnect becomes detrimental to the land.

Re: An Airbnb for farmland hits a snag, as farmers raise data privacy concerns

#74

Post by empath75 » Sun, May 17, 2020, 2:27 PM UTC

rmason wrote: post #40

Long term the Tillable idea won't fly. I worked with farmers as a fertilizer company agronomist for twenty years. If I understand it correctly Tillable is trying to insert themselves in the middle, acquire the right to sublease large amounts of land and mark it up. Say you own a farm and lease it out. The family you lease your land to might be a neighbor. In the winter they might plow your driveway gratis. They add f…

So then the land owner goes bankrupt and has to sell the land and Tillable buys it.

Re: An Airbnb for farmland hits a snag, as farmers raise data privacy concerns

#75

Post by luckylion » Sun, May 17, 2020, 2:31 PM UTC

randomdata wrote: post #68

TeMPOraL wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> If the farmer is willing to accept a $1200 price, then what prevents the land owner from charging $1200 right now? Basic human decency ? These are often long-term relationships between neighbours, whose families lived next to each other for decades or hundreds of years.

But those with such decency wouldn't turn to Tillable to capture an extra buck, so it remains unclear where you think Tillable fits.

Apparently nobody turns to Tillable. It's Tillable that's turning to land owners and tries to convince them to not renew their contracts with farmers so Tillable can negotiate new contracts with higher prices, likely with the same farmers (as farming is very much a local thing, you can't farm a piece of land from a thousand miles away).

Re: An Airbnb for farmland hits a snag, as farmers raise data privacy concerns

#76

Post by toss1 » Sun, May 17, 2020, 2:34 PM UTC

rmason wrote: post #40

Long term the Tillable idea won't fly. I worked with farmers as a fertilizer company agronomist for twenty years. If I understand it correctly Tillable is trying to insert themselves in the middle, acquire the right to sublease large amounts of land and mark it up. Say you own a farm and lease it out. The family you lease your land to might be a neighbor. In the winter they might plow your driveway gratis. They add f…

Yup, just like the formerly innovative companies that end up being managed by the financial types.

They now optimize for current profits and not market-leading innovation, so profits improve - for a (sometimes long) while. Then, the profits decline, and no amount of financial sleight-of-hand can make it improve, and the company is too far behind to invest in R&D to again lead.

It is making money by extraction not by creation. Nice while it lasts, but unsustainable.

If this method takes over for farmland, expect another 1930's dust bowl type of farm out put crash in some years (esp w/the increasing scarcity of critical potash/potassium).

So, let's hope this new 'Tillable' biz model dies sooner rather than later.

Re: An Airbnb for farmland hits a snag, as farmers raise data privacy concerns

#77

Post by toss1 » Sun, May 17, 2020, 2:43 PM UTC

yalogin wrote: post #11

If the farmers have decades long relationship with the landowners this looks like a power play by tillable/VCs to get in there and take a recurring cut. They know the farmers have no option but to rent land and the VCs know it. So they are using their money to pay cash to landowners and get them on the site. Probability wise there is a 90% chance that the land will be rented by the same farmer as before because of la…

Yes, but he smart landowners will realize that the same farmers will now need to pay more, and have a less direct and shorter-term connection to the land.

The farmer will have less means, and less motivation to invest in proper fertilization & care of the land.

This pushes everyone to a pure extractive business model, and away from investment.

The result will be land that is worth less until it is worthless.

All for a few more bucks up front.

Capitalism is not solving any problem here, it is creating a massive problem. What's the solution when a massive portion of the arable land is worthless?

Re: An Airbnb for farmland hits a snag, as farmers raise data privacy concerns

#78

Post by kasey_junk » Sun, May 17, 2020, 2:49 PM UTC

dd36 wrote: post #73

derekbreden wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That was close to my guess, the only small difference is I would add some maybe-ends-up-in-food-eventually crops as well. My family would refer to the roundup ready corn and soybeans we sold to the grain co-op as commodities, while the small sub-acreage of sweet corn grown to sell at the farmer’s market might be much more likely to be referred to as food. Food being a perhaps overly generous word for partially hydrog…

So, sprayed with more bug poison? I wonder if this disconnect becomes detrimental to the land.

Bigger difference is the breed of plant. Commodity corn for instance is not something a human would eat normally without extreme processing.

One way it becomes human good is as feed for animals and another is being processed into adjuncts.

Sweet corn on the other hand is delicious to eat.

I tend to think commodities vs food is if there is a mainline futures contract for it.

Re: An Airbnb for farmland hits a snag, as farmers raise data privacy concerns

#79

Post by saalweachter » Sun, May 17, 2020, 2:50 PM UTC

derekbreden wrote: post #43

tsimionescu wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm guessing commodity crops in this context may refer to non-food crops, like corn for bio-ethanol, rapeseed, cotton, tobacco?

That was close to my guess, the only small difference is I would add some maybe-ends-up-in-food-eventually crops as well. My family would refer to the roundup ready corn and soybeans we sold to the grain co-op as commodities, while the small sub-acreage of sweet corn grown to sell at the farmer’s market might be much more likely to be referred to as food. Food being a perhaps overly generous word for partially hydrog…

Commodity agriculture is any agriculture where the products are sold into the commodity markets, basically -- corn, wheat, soybeans, rice, pork, beef, etc.

Commodity agriculture is all about scale and price; there are certain quality standards that must be met (your corn must have a specific moisture content; your pigs must weigh in a certain range and be free of disease) but there is no real competition on the quality of the good produced. You assume all hard red wheat is fungible, and buy and sell it by the ton.

Some products exist in both commodity and non-commodity markets -- you can produce pork for the commodity markets, or your can sell it door to door.

Re: An Airbnb for farmland hits a snag, as farmers raise data privacy concerns

#80

Post by skybrian » Sun, May 17, 2020, 3:14 PM UTC

MattGaiser wrote: post #38

jelliclesfarm wrote: post #16

There is actually more to this than is visible on the surface. And I can’t talk about some of it. But here it is: 1. Climate Corp was part of Monsanto before it became Bayer. It was acquired by Monsanto. 2. John Deere wanted to buy Climate as well as Monsanto but that was struck down by US courts and Bayer bought Monsanto. 3. What was Climate Corp doing before? They had something called Field View where they charged…

> diff between food farming and commodity crop farming. What is the difference between these? Aren't crops generally commodities? I’m familiar with the subsistence farmer term of the crops they eat verses the crops they sell, but the farmers sell both here.

I don't know what the original poster meant, but there are fruits and vegetables that are mostly picked by hand and usually sold fresh, which distinguishes them from things like wheat and corn that can be grown on very large farms with little labor because it's been mechanized.

There are a handful of commodity crops grown at very large scale, and then there is everything else.

https://modernfarmer.com/2015/03/specialty-crops-refer-to-we...