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Apple unveils biggest update to Logic since the launch of Logic Pro X

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Re: Apple unveils biggest update to Logic since the launch of Logic Pro X

#51

Post by WalterSear »

crazygringo wrote: post #35
jasode wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>But yeah, AVID Pro Tools works on Windows so it doesn't do anything for Apple. Before Apple bought it, Emagic's Logic ran on both Windows and Mac. After Apple acquired Logic, they immediately discontinued the Windows version. Can't Apple hypothetically run the same playbook and discontinue Pro Tools for Windows?

Oh wow, I didn't know that. I mean, that seems like a pretty shitty thing to do to an existing userbase. I guess they could, but risk generating a lot of ill will. I'm curious how discontinuing Logic was received. Seems very risky.

It was clear back then that they didn't want Logic in order to improve it, as being evidenced here by with this hodgepodge of 'catchup' features.

Tbh, I'm surprised they hadn't dropped the product already.

Re: Apple unveils biggest update to Logic since the launch of Logic Pro X

#52

Post by phlakaton »

jasode wrote: post #2

I own Apple Logic and thus I'm grateful for the continuous updates. On the other hand, I'm mystified why Apple continues its investment in this audio program. Yes, when Steve Jobs bought Logic from Emagic in 2002, it made strategic sense to fortify Apple's "software portfolio" to make Mac hardware more attractive. But that was before the surprising massive success of iPhones in 2007. Now, it seems like sales of Logic…

I don't ask questions; I just gratefully take the cheap Logic updates as they come!

Re: Apple unveils biggest update to Logic since the launch of Logic Pro X

#53

Post by pier25 »

jasode wrote: post #17
crazygringo wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To be more specific, and in response to your reply: Together with Final Cut Pro, Apple wants to have Mac-only exclusive software that is aimed specifically at cool creative professionals to build up the image that trendy creatives use Macs (and you therefore have no choice but to use a Mac, otherwise you won't have the software you need). Aperture couldn't really compete with Adobe's whole workflow (since Apple didn'…

>But yeah, AVID Pro Tools works on Windows so it doesn't do anything for Apple. Before Apple bought it, Emagic's Logic ran on both Windows and Mac. After Apple acquired Logic, they immediately discontinued the Windows version. Can't Apple hypothetically run the same playbook and discontinue Pro Tools for Windows?

Apple could buy all DAW companies (Steinberg, Ableton, etc) for peanuts and destroy music production on Windows if they wanted. Heck they could even buy Adobe without much effort and make it mac exclusive too.

They don't do it probably because that would be considered a below the belt move and not worth the trouble since the mac is only 10% of its revenue.

Re: Apple unveils biggest update to Logic since the launch of Logic Pro X

#54

Post by whatok »

billjings wrote: post #23
vmception wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For decades creatives and even non-creatives were able to be convinced that "Macs were better for audio, video, photography" without any analysis of benchmarks, hardware differences, performance. This thought pattern transcended the PowerPC processor, to the off-the-shelf Intel processors that the competitors used, to the ARM processors the mobile devices used. Apple continuing that perception with at least software…

In my experience, musicians and other creative types care first and formost about getting results. So that means they need a toolchain that is flexible and rich enough to yield great results. Performance is a factor there, inasmuch as it constrains results. The toolchain part is pretty broad: this includes OS services (audio routing!), outboard hardware, DAWs and video editors, and third party plugins. When comparing…

It really is incredible how badly Apple screwed up video.

Re: Apple unveils biggest update to Logic since the launch of Logic Pro X

#55

Post by salimmadjd »

MusicTechHelpGuy on Youtube has summarized all the updates.

If you're new to Logic really recommend his YT channel he has one of the most complete Logic training out there and it's all for free. His videos are a great place to start for Logic beginners

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z-150Nxem5g

Re: Apple unveils biggest update to Logic since the launch of Logic Pro X

#56

Post by pier25 »

whatok wrote: post #48
pier25 wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Bitwig is amazing, specially now with The Grid. But it's still the underdog. If it becomes more popular I'm sure the price will go up at some point.

I wouldn't really compare the two. They target much different markets.

True, and neither is Ableton Live, but look at all the new features in Logic blatantly copied from Live.

Re: Apple unveils biggest update to Logic since the launch of Logic Pro X

#57

Post by gbjw »

jasode wrote: post #2

I own Apple Logic and thus I'm grateful for the continuous updates. On the other hand, I'm mystified why Apple continues its investment in this audio program. Yes, when Steve Jobs bought Logic from Emagic in 2002, it made strategic sense to fortify Apple's "software portfolio" to make Mac hardware more attractive. But that was before the surprising massive success of iPhones in 2007. Now, it seems like sales of Logic…

It's the same reason Apple invests so heavily in Pages, Keynote and Numbers (all free apps on three different platforms). They believe that building software internally (taking hardware into account) leads to a better user experience, and sparks an intangible 'joy' when using their products--a sense of completeness that transcends software and hardware. This was the core of Jobs' philosophy and I think still drives the entire company.

Re: Apple unveils biggest update to Logic since the launch of Logic Pro X

#58

Post by danpalmer »

jasode wrote: post #2

I own Apple Logic and thus I'm grateful for the continuous updates. On the other hand, I'm mystified why Apple continues its investment in this audio program. Yes, when Steve Jobs bought Logic from Emagic in 2002, it made strategic sense to fortify Apple's "software portfolio" to make Mac hardware more attractive. But that was before the surprising massive success of iPhones in 2007. Now, it seems like sales of Logic…

Other responses have made great points about why it's worth something, but I'll take another tack:

I don't think it costs Apple much to do this.

How much does it cost to keep Logic around? There's engineering/product/design costs, marketing, and training/selling costs in store. The training probably pays for itself and not many staff at Apple Stores are trained anyway. There's very little marketing, so it's entirely possible there is no dedicated marketing resource for Logic.

As for the product/engineering/design, it's well known that Apple is pretty lean on these sorts of things and often has far smaller teams than outsiders expect. I could see this easily being no more than a team of 5 at this point, maybe less. It obviously took a lot more to get it to this point, but with very few features over the last ~5 years, it's possible that it's been iterated enough to just be easy to maintain in its current form (assuming no major changes).

All in maintenance team budget could be <$2m/year (not including store training in this). Apple probably spent that on door handles in the new HQ, and I can see Logic being as important a "halo" project as the HQ door handles.

Re: Apple unveils biggest update to Logic since the launch of Logic Pro X

#59

Post by djaychela »

crazygringo wrote: post #35
jasode wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>But yeah, AVID Pro Tools works on Windows so it doesn't do anything for Apple. Before Apple bought it, Emagic's Logic ran on both Windows and Mac. After Apple acquired Logic, they immediately discontinued the Windows version. Can't Apple hypothetically run the same playbook and discontinue Pro Tools for Windows?

Oh wow, I didn't know that. I mean, that seems like a pretty shitty thing to do to an existing userbase. I guess they could, but risk generating a lot of ill will. I'm curious how discontinuing Logic was received. Seems very risky.

Music Tech teacher here... when it was discontinued, I was working (part time) in a couple of schools who used Logic on PCs, as well as working for a few people who used it in their own studios.

In the case of one of the schools and a number of the clients, I was the one who broke the news to them - generally greeted by disbelief initially, and then once they had checked up on it, absolute fury. If the intention was to get people to buy Macs so they could keep running Logic, in most cases it backfired spectacularly, and made life-long Apple enemies of those users - many of which either stuck with their old version of Logic for a number of years, or who jumped ship to Cubase (in the case of the schools, software cost would have been dwarfed by hardware cost when you have labs of 30+ computers, let alone trying to persuade a Windows-oriented ICT department to support Macs in any way, shape or form).

Re: Apple unveils biggest update to Logic since the launch of Logic Pro X

#60

Post by whatok »

pier25 wrote: post #56
whatok wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wouldn't really compare the two. They target much different markets.

True, and neither is Ableton Live, but look at all the new features in Logic blatantly copied from Live.

It's definitely a good way to branch out on their current user base and probably makes a lot more sense for people starting out to buy Logic than base Ableton. Ableton Suite just doesn't seem like a great value vs Logic unless you absolutely need something in Ableton.
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