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U.S. Senators Advocate H-1B Freeze for 60 Days or Longer

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Re: U.S. Senators Advocate H-1B Freeze for 60 Days or Longer

#61

Post by rory096 »

toomuchtodo wrote: post #42
melling wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What is tech unemployment? Still in the single digits?

Sounds like it's still above 0, which means you should be forced to source local talent before you're permitted to source from outside the country. It's so strange to me that this viewport is controversial, but "Buy Local" (which I have yet to encounter someone who is against supporting local businesses) is not. This is the labor version of "Buy Local".

>Sounds like it's still above 0

Because of frictional unemployment, it's neither possible nor desirable for the unemployment rate to reach 0.

>which means you should be forced to source local talent before you're permitted to source from outside the country.

This is already a requirement; H-1B employers must attest that they can't find an employee domestically and have made a good faith attempt to do so.

>It's so strange to me that this viewport is controversial, but "Buy Local" (which I have yet to encounter someone who is against supporting local businesses) is not. This is the labor version of "Buy Local".

Buy Local is not enforced by the jackboot of the federal government. You're free to hire only non-visa workers for your business.

Re: U.S. Senators Advocate H-1B Freeze for 60 Days or Longer

#62

Post by dudul »

KorematsuFred wrote: post #46
matsemann wrote: post #24

I thought H-1B was for when one was unable to source enough skilled people locally? If so, it should kinda be self-adjusting if more high skilled people are unemployed, right?

Us issues around 500k green cards a year. 85k h1bs are a drop in a bucket compared to that. There are over 1M Indians stuck on gc backlog because of the racist gc caps. Various groups such as cis, fair etc. Want them out and hence these backdoor l Also not even sure what

GC caps are not based on race but on citizenship.

A GC worker does not obey to the same rules as a H1B worker. A GC worker is not dependent on the company to remain in the country, they do not help companies keep salaries artificially low. A green card holder is essentially a US citizen on the job market (minus DOD clearance and such).

Re: U.S. Senators Advocate H-1B Freeze for 60 Days or Longer

#63

Post by debt »

curiousllama wrote: post #16

This is a backdoor immigration cut, nothing more. COVID is irrelevant. Remember that it's not just new entrants that need H1B processing: it's immigrants currently in the country that need to transfer their visa type (e.g., former students moving from OPT to H1B). What, are they supposed to leave or risk being denied a visa forevermore? Not to mention, they've already paused green card processing and shut down most o…

“ high-skilled immigrants anymore.”

That’s funny. I don’t see how project managers are highly skilled labor. I don’t see how QA testers are highly skilled labor.

But I do see how to get people to work harder for less.

Re: U.S. Senators Advocate H-1B Freeze for 60 Days or Longer

#64

Post by blisterpeanuts »

KorematsuFred wrote: post #53
curiousllama wrote: post #16

This is a backdoor immigration cut, nothing more. COVID is irrelevant. Remember that it's not just new entrants that need H1B processing: it's immigrants currently in the country that need to transfer their visa type (e.g., former students moving from OPT to H1B). What, are they supposed to leave or risk being denied a visa forevermore? Not to mention, they've already paused green card processing and shut down most o…

There are over 200k Indians who are stuck on h1b for more than 10 years. Most of which have us born kids. Makes no sense to have a 60 day freeze on h1bs

10 years in the U.S.? I thought the path to citizenship or green card was 5 years, or 7 years at most? This is really not a very fair system.

Re: U.S. Senators Advocate H-1B Freeze for 60 Days or Longer

#65

Post by koheripbal »

alistairSH wrote: post #44
matsemann wrote: post #24

I thought H-1B was for when one was unable to source enough skilled people locally? If so, it should kinda be self-adjusting if more high skilled people are unemployed, right?

That's its stated purpose, which is why you see it mostly used for software and science positions. However, it's been "abused" by large consulting/contracting companies who hire an army of immigrant labor at the low end of market wages. The H1B recipient can't do much about it - they're tied to the employer (and their spouse can't work unless they also get an H1B). Yes, they can move jobs, but it takes legal resource…

Can confirm. Our requirement to fit the "cannot find American" requirement was to post a tiny ad in a small unknown paper with a ton of requirements that they H1-B we were about to hire didn't himself even really meet.

It was HIGHLY abused to just get cheap low-level IT staff. ...like the kinds who confuse Java with Javascript.

Re: U.S. Senators Advocate H-1B Freeze for 60 Days or Longer

#66

Post by raverbashing »

dudul wrote: post #34
raverbashing wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Then change the rules to make it more difficult for the body shops maybe? Doesn't seem too hard

Any proposal? They change the rules almost yearly to try to patch loopholes. What do you suggest?

> They change the rules almost yearly to try to patch loopholes

I haven't seen much in this way. As for what I would propose (if the quotas would be kept)

- Go through the applications by higher salaries first

- Limit the number of hires per company by number of current employees (something like 1 H1-B for every 5 employees - as an example)

- Make the visa transferable after a while

Re: U.S. Senators Advocate H-1B Freeze for 60 Days or Longer

#67

Post by giobox »

user5994461 wrote: post #13
ycombonator wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Estimated to be 400,000 mostly in IT.

Should clarify that this is IT as in low level positions in cheap outsourcing firms. Not to confuse with tech companies. Edit: You can see visas per company here with average salary https://h1bdata.info/topcompanies.php You can make an opinion for yourself but suffice to say that the bulk of the jobs are in cheap outsourcing firms, not in tech companies. (cf. google 15k VS tata consulting 73k)

Absolute nonsense. One of the biggest beneficiaries of the H1B program have been FAANG - they often apply for some of the largest numbers. I’ve also seen this in personal experience, as will anyone who has worked at these companies. Hiring at these companies is typically focused on just hiring the best candidate, who will often need a visa such as this if they are not American.

Abuse by firms such as infosys and “bodyshopping” are of course a problem as well, but Microsoft, google et al love these visas too.

A lot of people who work in very senior positions in this industry came here via an H1B, it’s not just low level positions.

Re: U.S. Senators Advocate H-1B Freeze for 60 Days or Longer

#68

Post by JackPoach »

koheripbal wrote: post #56
JackPoach wrote: post #40

I think this is quite good in a strange way. Nobody was happy about H1-B. Tech companies were complaining that quotas were too low. Skilled workers complained that this is a ploy to keep costs down, especially in academia. I've once heard an American PhD say 'I am not afraid of competing with very smart Chinese or Indian scientists. But they are making me compete with 10 mediocre Chinese or Indian PhDs and nobody can…

This isn't a logical argument. The companies that hire H1-Bs are obviously going to be even less happy now that the quota is down to ZERO.

My argument is not this. My argument is that NEITHER party was happy with the current system. So, in a way, getting rid of it entirely and starting with scratch might be a good thing. I do realize that there's HUGE human costs to people on H1-B visas who will have their lives totally destroyed by this decision. My sympathies are with them.

Re: U.S. Senators Advocate H-1B Freeze for 60 Days or Longer

#70

Post by sobellian »

toomuchtodo wrote: post #42
melling wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What is tech unemployment? Still in the single digits?

Sounds like it's still above 0, which means you should be forced to source local talent before you're permitted to source from outside the country. It's so strange to me that this viewport is controversial, but "Buy Local" (which I have yet to encounter someone who is against supporting local businesses) is not. This is the labor version of "Buy Local".

As a private citizen you aren't legally mandated to buy local. I don't begrudge someone for buying local themselves but it's annoying when they want to force that decision on me.

At any rate I think your analogy makes more sense for services procured from outside the U.S. If you hire someone who then relocates to the U.S. they become local by definition.

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