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YouTube removed a viral video of two doctors calling for an end to quarantine

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Re: YouTube removed a viral video of two doctors calling for an end to quarantine

#181

Post by p1necone »

busymom0 wrote: post #168
dangus wrote: post #163

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Absolutely. Yes, I am. I don’t listen to people like Bill Maher, either, nor TV sensationalists like Jake Tapper. I would prefer this country mostly get back to being centrist. I would prefer we not continually be pitched against each other in a left vs right battle that’s encouraged by the elite class (including middle-men profiteers like Glenn Beck that earn based on outrage).

I doubt that. Unless you consider the far left sources to be moderate.

Something tells me you consider everything that isn't Fox News and Breitbart to be far left?

Re: YouTube removed a viral video of two doctors calling for an end to quarantine

#182

Post by ceejayoz »

briefcomment wrote: post #167
gmfawcett wrote: post #47

This is lazy reporting. It's not wrong, but there's no insight here. No critical assessment of the claims made in the video nor the Youtube T&C, just a few clickbaity excerpts and some reaction comments. Compare with this excellent piece by the CBC on a somewhat similar viral video in Canada: https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/saskatchewan/u-of-r-biology-p...

Can someone address the claim that death certificates coerce doctors to list COVID as the cause of death even if it hasn't been shown definitively to be the case? Is this a thing?

We can make a pretty good estimate of COVID deaths by comparing against past years. There's a clear, large spike - NYC's death rate is six times the average for this time of year.

https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2020/04/21/world/coronav...

https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2020/04/27/upshot/corona...

Giving that we're still low on tests, if someone dies before a test of COVID-like symptoms, it makes sense to consider them a probable (and save the test for someone alive) if deaths are 6x normal - you've got a roughly 5/6 chance of being correct.

Re: YouTube removed a viral video of two doctors calling for an end to quarantine

#183

Post by mikem170 »

robocat wrote: post #39
mikem170 wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>The last flu to cause such a severe spike in mortality statistics was the devastating 1918 Spanish flu The second wave of the 1918 flu killed between 17 to 50 million people, perhaps as high as 100 million people, during the fall of 1918, with a higher than expected mortality rate for the young and healthy. It killed between 1 and 6 percent of the world's population. So far 200,000 people have died from the coronavi…

> The current coronavirus is 1/100 as deadly as the flu of 1918. Wow: you are saying the final death rate from Covid19 will be from 0.01% to 0.06%. You are making irrelevant comparisons: we don’t yet know how many people will die from Covid19; we have no idea of numbers of deaths in many poorer countries where deaths can’t even be counted; comparing number of deaths in a world with 7 billion people against number of…

I agree with what you are saying, the numbers I presented in response to a comparison with the 1918 flu are not good to draw conclusions from.

In fact I will admit that thinking further about the numbers we have so far I am sobered by how they may add up across the world.

But back on topic, talking about lockdowns: The stated purpose of the lockdown was to flatten the curve so that hospitals are not overwhelmed, which has been successful so far. Do you think lockdowns lower the number of deaths when all is said and done? How long can lockdowns be sustained? Would it be more effective for vulnerable folks to self-isolate? Unless we can mass produce a vaccine in the next couple of months won't this continue moving through the population regardless of what we do?

Re: YouTube removed a viral video of two doctors calling for an end to quarantine

#184

Post by brink »

necubi wrote: post #162
manfredo wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are infections and death tolls in the countries with much less restrictive measures an order of magnitude higher?

New York has >50x deaths per capita as SF, which sheltered-in-place a week earlier (and which had been steadily moving in that direction for two weeks prior).

This could be a different story a year from now, where NY ripped the band-aid off and achieved herd immunity long before SF, and SF took a much longer time resulting in a longer economical slump and still similar deaths over a longer period of time.

I'm not saying it will be that way, but it's worth considering.

Re: YouTube removed a viral video of two doctors calling for an end to quarantine

#185

Post by olliej »

golergka wrote: post #161
techntoke wrote: post #142

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Businesses have the right to refuse service, why should YouTube be any different? I think the solution is a decentralized video sharing platform.

> why should YouTube be any different? Because it's almost a monopoly. It's not one of roughly equal dozens video hosting services. It's freaking youtube.

No it’s not. There are innumerable hosting services.

The crux is people wanting to spread their views but who don’t want to pay to do that.

Re: YouTube removed a viral video of two doctors calling for an end to quarantine

#186

Post by threeseed »

forgot_my_pwd wrote: post #88
gmfawcett wrote: post #47

This is lazy reporting. It's not wrong, but there's no insight here. No critical assessment of the claims made in the video nor the Youtube T&C, just a few clickbaity excerpts and some reaction comments. Compare with this excellent piece by the CBC on a somewhat similar viral video in Canada: https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/saskatchewan/u-of-r-biology-p...

But that misses the point. The very fact that a few people at Google/Youtube have the power to censor whomever they want for whatever reason they choose is a problem in itself. Are the doctors in the video saying untruths or misrepresenting data? I think what they said in the video was eminently reasonable. But perhaps I'm wrong. Luckily we have the freedom to publicly critique their claims - assuming our critiques a…

If you were a bit more self aware you would realise how hypocritical you are.

You want your freedom to communicate what you want. But you don't want Google/Youtube to have their freedom. They are a private website who should have the right to host whatever content they choose and free to look after their own interests.

And remember nobody is stopping you from exercising your freedom to host whatever content you like on your private website.

Re: YouTube removed a viral video of two doctors calling for an end to quarantine

#187

Post by busymom0 »

dangus wrote: post #148
busymom0 wrote: post #141

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What kind of argument is that? Political views are unimportant in this case and even if they were, Glenn has been more left and right leaning. Also YouTube removing the videos from 2 highly credentialed doctors is a verifiable fact, not some subjective theory.

I think you have trust working backwards. This is a media company that was founded only two years ago by a talk radio and television host who holds no journalism degree or higher education accreditation of any kind, who already runs a conservative media personality cult. And I’m expected to just keep an open mind about it and assume that this dude isn’t being disingenuous.

> far right

People have started labelling anything they disagree with as "far right" now a days. How exactly is wanting to work to be able to pay the bills and take care for ones family a "far right" thing? How is calling out the rise in domestic abuse, child abuse, suicides, mental health issues a "far right" thing? I have many friends both left and right leaning who are struggling to pay the bills and have businesses shutdown with massive losses wanting to return back to work.

Also one could say the same thing about left leaning media (95% of the mainstream media and tech companies). When we start labelling everything we disagree with as "BAD NAME", we are living in a sad world.

And in case it matters (I feel like it does to you), I am a brown immigrant myself.

Re: YouTube removed a viral video of two doctors calling for an end to quarantine

#188

Post by djsumdog »

ghthor wrote: post #172
ceejayoz wrote: post #138

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Are the doctors in the video saying untruths or misrepresenting data? Yes, they are. https://www.dailynews.com/2020/04/28/california-doctors-with... > But public health experts were quick to debunk the doctors’ findings as misguided and riddled with statistical errors — and an example of the kind of misleading information they are forced to waste precious time disputing. > The doctors should never have assumed that…

I don't understand what's wrong with the data they presented. That article doesn't explain it, it just says it's wrong. There applications of data make perfect sense to me, that's how I'd use the data they presented. That article makes inaccurate statements like, "basically hyped a bunch of data and weren’t transparent about their methods" which is not true. There were 100% transparent about where there information w…

People should be able to see all the opinions of various experts; doctors in NYC, doctors in Minnesota. Just them on their merits and examine the evidence.

By pulling videos, YouTube/Google is saying they don't trust people to be able to discern anything or do research among several dissenting opinions. And yes, it's their platform and yada yada .. they still allow a lot of content to be uploaded and they have become the most typical/standard centralized source of videos.

I will admit, they might be right to not trust people ... at which point why do we even care about humanity anymore? Are those with more power and influence always going to think the rest of the world are sheep who can't think for themselves and need to be led around?

This time sets all kinds of dangerous prescients. I wish Orwell was still alive.

Re: YouTube removed a viral video of two doctors calling for an end to quarantine

#189

Post by busymom0 »

p1necone wrote: post #170
busymom0 wrote: post #141

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What kind of argument is that? Political views are unimportant in this case and even if they were, Glenn has been more left and right leaning. Also YouTube removing the videos from 2 highly credentialed doctors is a verifiable fact, not some subjective theory.

It's not a case of right or left leaning bias here - Glenn Beck pushes conspiracy theories and things that just aren't true. There's a difference between political leanings and full on crackpot journalism.

Examples?

Re: YouTube removed a viral video of two doctors calling for an end to quarantine

#190

Post by foolinaround »

CamperBob2 wrote: post #174
threatofrain wrote: post #106

> We're actually seeing the patients. Dr. Fauci hasn't seen a patient for 20 years... it's like the general contractor vs the sub. He's not seeing patients, he's in an ivory tower, and we have a world of respect for him, he's a world reknown immunologist, two different, he's an academic, and we've dealt with academics all of our lives... but academics and reality are two different things. > Coronavirus lasts on plast…

Let's look at the death rates, no it's not. They're similar in prevalence and in death rate. That statement alone is justification for removing their video as a public health hazard.

There's lots and lots of bad stuff there... The question is should youtube be censoring it?

if so, why this, and not others?

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