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Problems with Japan's Covid-19 reports

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Re: Problems with Japan's Covid-19 reports

#61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Whatever China says must ALWAYS be a lie, on the other hand, the US numbers are not "suppressed," it's just incompetence. Well, this jibes with reality. I could care less about actual case counts - few countries are close to having the capacity to test everyone so who cares. What is a huge problem with China is the death statistics. Looking at Lombardy with 6k+ deaths with the outbreak not yet peaked, am I really s…

>"Well, this jives with reality." You want "jibes" here. Jive means to talk nonsense: https://www.grammarbook.com/homonyms/jibe-jive.asp

thanks for the tip; will edit

Re: Problems with Japan's Covid-19 reports

#62
Looks mostly right but he is wrong about the Diamond Princess. Those people all went off home, which is not Japan. Mostly western states. So they don't count to the Japanese numbers, only did in the very beginning.

The rest looks indeed cooked, on purpose. Pasting images instead of tables is the usual trick.

Re: Problems with Japan's Covid-19 reports

#63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is a false equivalency. China is a totalitarian state that quite literally controls information; Japan and the US are not in any real sense. About six months ago, on a different HN topic, I said this about China's claim that foreigners committed crimes and thus couldn't leave the country: I call it “crying wolf in reverse”: The problem with being a totalitarian state that falsely imprisons people on a regular ba…

For what it’s worth, the Japanese justice system has an over 99% conviction rate.

Whats that number like in the US? Is it also 99%?

Re: Problems with Japan's Covid-19 reports

#64
post #23

The team behind https://covid19japan.com fights with this nonsense every day. We're open ears to improvements, and are playing with ways to possibly automate bits. Our GitHub: https://github.com/reustle/covid19japan/

I wish there was something like this for the UK!

Re: Problems with Japan's Covid-19 reports

#65

Popular opinion in the US regarding the integrity of various countries' coronavirus reporting is hilarious. Whatever China says must ALWAYS be a lie, on the other hand, the US numbers are not "suppressed," it's just incompetence. Meanwhile, nobody is batting an eye at Japan's ridiculously and obviously doctored numbers. Hey guys, maybe China was just having literally the same organizational problems the US is having…

> Whatever China says must ALWAYS be a lie, on the other hand, the US numbers are not "suppressed," it's just incompetence. Well, this jibes with reality. I could care less about actual case counts - few countries are close to having the capacity to test everyone so who cares. What is a huge problem with China is the death statistics. Looking at Lombardy with 6k+ deaths with the outbreak not yet peaked, am I really s…

Honestly does anyone believe China’s death statistics? I think the west believes than more than even those living under communist rule in China, and that says a lot.

Re: Problems with Japan's Covid-19 reports

#66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

These claims have no basis in facts. The case fatality rate varies greatly depends on whether the health capacity is being overwhelmed, because when you don't have enough ICU beds or ventilators, your seriously ill patients cannot live. Lombardy experienced a greater strain on its medical system than Wuhan ever did. China sent 40,000 medical professionals from the rest of the country to Wuhan where has Lombardy had l…

> When you do widespread testing as China did in Zhejiang you can find a lot of mild cases. Indeed, Iceland, which did the same, has 1020 cases and 2 deaths. Two significant notes, however: * China reports that its outbreak has largely resolved. The vast majority of the 1,000 cases in Iceland are still active, so we don't know how many deaths Iceland will eventually have. South Korea's current fatality rate still see…

Guangdong China: 320,000 tests by Feb 28,

2820 positive cases.

Positive rate: 0.8%

Iceland: 3,787 tests by March 18,

330 positive cases.

Positive rate: 8.7%

Clearly Guangdong did more testing with respect to its epidemic than Iceland.

Let's look at New York State:

172,360 tests by March 29,

59513 positive cases

Positive rate: 34.5%

Re: Problems with Japan's Covid-19 reports

#67

Popular opinion in the US regarding the integrity of various countries' coronavirus reporting is hilarious. Whatever China says must ALWAYS be a lie, on the other hand, the US numbers are not "suppressed," it's just incompetence. Meanwhile, nobody is batting an eye at Japan's ridiculously and obviously doctored numbers. Hey guys, maybe China was just having literally the same organizational problems the US is having…

This is a false equivalency. China is a totalitarian state that quite literally controls information; Japan and the US are not in any real sense. About six months ago, on a different HN topic, I said this about China's claim that foreigners committed crimes and thus couldn't leave the country: I call it “crying wolf in reverse”: The problem with being a totalitarian state that falsely imprisons people on a regular ba…

> This is a false equivalency. China is a totalitarian state that quite literally controls information; Japan and the US are not in any real sense.

This is true, but what makes both the US and China (and many other countries at the moment) similar is they are controlled by governments with strong nationalist tendencies. Any state has the ability to control these stats by limiting the availability of testing. A nationalist-leaning state has an even stronger incentive to do so, because it leans even more heavily on the thesis that its nation is essentially different than others. This however, runs into the reality that this virus doesn't differentiate based on our cultural construct of nations.

Until a few days ago, you saw this most markedly in India, which just recently made a sudden U-turn in its denial of the problem.

In China's case, nationalism is coordinated with its totalitarianism, which as you point out makes it different. The Chinese response should be scrutinized for its initial failures as much as its later successes.

The saving grace in the US is that even though we have leadership incentivized by nationalist and self-preservatory urges to minimize the true magnitude of the problem, hospitals and state/local officials can publicly express that they are seeing a large number of likely cases that they can't test for, and publicly demand more testing and treatment capacity from federal authorities.

That is pretty much the dynamic that has been happening in the US for nearly a month - exemplified in the public war of words between state governors in initially affected states (CA, NY, MI, etc) and the Administration. And at this point, it's abundantly clear that the tide of truth is on the side of those state governors and public health officials. This is why military hospital ships are now showing up in Los Angeles and New York.

Re: Problems with Japan's Covid-19 reports

#68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Whatever China says must ALWAYS be a lie, on the other hand, the US numbers are not "suppressed," it's just incompetence. Well, this jibes with reality. I could care less about actual case counts - few countries are close to having the capacity to test everyone so who cares. What is a huge problem with China is the death statistics. Looking at Lombardy with 6k+ deaths with the outbreak not yet peaked, am I really s…

>"Well, this jives with reality." You want "jibes" here. Jive means to talk nonsense: https://www.grammarbook.com/homonyms/jibe-jive.asp

Huh. I figured that "jive" was a musical term first-and-foremost, and therefore to say "jiving with" was a bit like saying "grooving with" or more generally "in sync with."

But apparently the use of the word "jive" to mean "talking nonsense" is the older, original usage, and the type of music/dance is named after the term, rather than the other way around. TIL.

Re: Problems with Japan's Covid-19 reports

#69

Popular opinion in the US regarding the integrity of various countries' coronavirus reporting is hilarious. Whatever China says must ALWAYS be a lie, on the other hand, the US numbers are not "suppressed," it's just incompetence. Meanwhile, nobody is batting an eye at Japan's ridiculously and obviously doctored numbers. Hey guys, maybe China was just having literally the same organizational problems the US is having…

This is a false equivalency. China is a totalitarian state that quite literally controls information; Japan and the US are not in any real sense. About six months ago, on a different HN topic, I said this about China's claim that foreigners committed crimes and thus couldn't leave the country: I call it “crying wolf in reverse”: The problem with being a totalitarian state that falsely imprisons people on a regular ba…

> China is a totalitarian state that quite literally controls information; Japan and the US are not in any real sense.

The US has a long history of spreading misinformation and lies too. Japan also tried to cover up its WW2 crimes.

Point is, all governments want to control information to a certain degree.

Re: Problems with Japan's Covid-19 reports

#70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think the main issue is that the Internet ( especially reddit, and to a lesser extent, HN) is just not a good place for nuanced discussion. China = totalitarian = bad. Any good results are either by luck or a lie. USA = democracy = good. Any bad results are due to incompetence or Trump/Hillary (depending on your leanings). Plenty of people exist in the gray area, but they're not going to be upvoted. Any post in sup…

> Mass surveillance network Citation needed. Live traffic feeds are common here in the US[1] and other countries. [1] https://transportation.arlingtonva.us/live-traffic-cameras/

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