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Instacart’s gig workers are planning a nationwide strike

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Re: Instacart’s gig workers are planning a nationwide strike

#71

Post by imgabe »

wpietri wrote: post #64
imgabe wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It always amazes me how the discussion can go so quickly go from "The mighty market solves all problems!" to, "The market is an incredibly fragile flower, and the slightest worker protections will result in mass unemployment and starvation!" The market will continue to function just fine. It is just that the outcome of manipulating it is usually not what the manipulators intended. Suppose I thought that Instacart w…

I'm all for providing health care (not insurance) via taxes. I think the burden of (mandatory) sick time should fall on the company, because otherwise you create an enormous parallel bureaucracy and require a one-size-fits-all solution to a problem that requires a lot more nuance. As to other benefits, it depends, but a lot of those are probably best left in the hands of the company in that they're another form of co…

As far as I understand, in other countries that provide, say mandatory maternity/paternity leave, there is a benefit provided by the government that covers at least part of that (not sure about sick leave). Otherwise you kill small businesses. Google can easily afford to cover someone's pay if they are out sick or on parental leave or whatever. A five person shop might not be able to afford to continue paying 20% of their workforce without the work getting done.

The harder you make it to start and run a small business, the fewer small businesses there are, which means everyone works for and is a customer of the same increasingly small pool of ever larger businesses. Which means that money and power continue to concentrate in the small group of people that run and own those businesses.

There are second and third order effects to things like "just make everyone offer paid sick time" that need to be considered.

Re: Instacart’s gig workers are planning a nationwide strike

#72

Post by earthshot »

toomuchtodo wrote: post #9
onlyrealcuzzo wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Don't companies not pay taxes for gig workers to get unemployment? Is there going to be any change to that?

No. Gig workers are "self employed", who traditionally do not pay unemployment insurance such that traditional employers do (as a sole proprietor; if you incorporate and pay yourself as an employee, you would then be eligible for unemployment insurance; I imagine this is very rare as a gig worker, and unsure if any platforms support such a configuration). This legislation doesn't change that, but it likely pulls some…

In my experience as a business owner I was not eligible to collect unemployment insurance even though I had to pay into it. Worst of both worlds.

Re: Instacart’s gig workers are planning a nationwide strike

#73

Post by aeyes »

ivanonymous wrote: post #15

These workers would be dependent contractors in Germany or Canada, I think. Defining that in-between category in the US would allow for some useful compromises. Especially because full employee comes with so much baggage here, e.g. health insurance. https://www.wolfbaldwin.com/articles/small-business-articles...

Instacart operates in Canada and from what I hear it's pretty much the same as in the US.

Re: Instacart’s gig workers are planning a nationwide strike

#74

Post by tedunangst »

woofie11 wrote: post #39

I would rather pay a higher delivery fee and (1) have enough workers to deliver my goods (2) Have them (and me) protected adequately. The whole way delivery works is broken right now.

Next up: InstaCart adds a $2 "safety" fee to every order, then pockets the money. Kinda like Uber added a $1 to every ride, but without actually spending the money on background checks, etc.

Re: Instacart’s gig workers are planning a nationwide strike

#75

Post by drjesusphd »

markdown wrote: post #66
JumpCrisscross wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Do people really not like the idea of collective bargaining Since the gutting of private-sector unions, the average American’s exposure to collective bargaining is public employee union strikes.

Your implication being that the average American who is negatively affected by a public employee union strike takes the side of the government and blames workers for inconveniencing them?

It's far more petty than that. No one actually has to be inconvenienced. The average American is just plain resentful of unionized public employees.

Re: Instacart’s gig workers are planning a nationwide strike

#76

Post by throwaway2019B »

sabujp wrote: post #21

Instacart's Web UI does not work. The search feature is completely broken and always shows a picture of the sad milk bottle, as is the update cart feature (before the shopper starts shopping) where you can search for an item and add it to your cart. I tried the same update cart feature in the app and while it is able to find items, tapping add to cart just shows the button depress animation and the item never gets ad…

I imagine you're being downvoted because your comment is incredibly irrelevant to the matter being discussed.

Re: Instacart’s gig workers are planning a nationwide strike

#77

Post by drjesusphd »

briandear wrote: post #41
claudeganon wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It’s a joke. I know people who have been to the ER with severe symptoms who were turned away without testing (mostly because they’re young and “expected” to recover). Every company that’s using testing as a precondition for benefits, when testing has been widely reported to be unavailable, is despicable.

I went to Stanford last weekend with a slight fever and sore throat and was tested and had results in about 16 hours. You could go right now and get tested there if you have symptoms. It’s an anecdote, sure, but the idea that people can’t get tested isn’t completely true.

"Well, it's not a problem for me..."

Re: Instacart’s gig workers are planning a nationwide strike

#78

Post by outside1234 »

joejohnson wrote: post #42
jefftk wrote: post #34

Unfortunately for these workers, with the unprecedented spike in unemployment [1] I suspect Instacart will be able to find a lot of desperate people willing to cross the picket line. [1] https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/ICSA

The Instacart workers should encourage any scabs to instead join the strike so they can work together to demand better wages and conditions.

Good luck with that

Re: Instacart’s gig workers are planning a nationwide strike

#79

Post by nexuist »

koolba wrote: post #68
jariel wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Me too, but neither you nor I represent the market. If there was a sufficient market for all of this to work out, it probably would have existed before Instacart. Instacart provides no innovation, other than dumping investor money on the market, and externalizing a lot of cost and risk onto gig workers, thereby making the price of delivery somewhat worthwhile ... for now. The moment the workers are paid reasonably an…

> Since when do the unit metrics on this business add up? Never. Without VC money or gig workers who do not understand the costs of depreciation this model does not work for something as low margin as groceries. At 10% margin, which is insane for groceries, you’d need a $100+ order to breaking even the cost of delivery. Forget actually making a profit. And real margins are closer to 2-3%.

Over $100 is insane for groceries? We regularly spend that much for a family of three almost every weekend. Admittedly, we are in a high CoL area.

Re: Instacart’s gig workers are planning a nationwide strike

#80

Post by fnordfnordfnord »

jefftk wrote: post #34

Unfortunately for these workers, with the unprecedented spike in unemployment [1] I suspect Instacart will be able to find a lot of desperate people willing to cross the picket line. [1] https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/ICSA

No requirement to look for work for the unemployed, that's been waived, at least in my state.
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