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How South Korea Reined In The Outbreak Without Shutting Everything Down

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Re: How South Korea Reined In The Outbreak Without Shutting Everything Down

#121

Post by krab »

aneutron wrote: post #69
raaaaraaaa12 wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We have face mask mandatory now in Czech Republic, Italy scared us and goverment reacted quickly. Its not over yet but we are on the right track. https://news.expats.cz/health-medical/breaking-face-covering...

Can you please attest to the correctness of the news about the Czech government stealing a shipment of masks that was meant to be delivered to Italy [1] ? If so, is there something the "outsiders" are missing (e.g. some political bs between the two countries) ? Or is it just plain old theft ? [1]: https://www.reuters.com/article/us-health-coronavirus-czech-...

It's not clear how the masks appeared in that storage. It may be well possible the masks were stolen by somebody who wanted to sell them. The company owning the storage didn't comment.

The masks were sent to Italy within a few days.

Re: How South Korea Reined In The Outbreak Without Shutting Everything Down

#122

Post by Maximus9000 »

supdatecron wrote: post #120
mcsb4 wrote: post #21

Again another article that doesn't even mention the use of masks and hand sanitizer. The cost of the epidemic now goes into the trillions, self-made cotton masks are cheap compared to the economic damage. They can be disinfected in boiling water and if everybody uses them they will help to stop the spreading of the virus. In all the countries mentioned in the article people wear masks when in public, often just again…

There was a study that showed cotton masks can actually be worse. A medical person showed me the other day, I’ll have to ask for the link

There is also a study that shows many studies findings cannot be reproduced: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Replication_crisis

From where I stand, the countries that have a culture of wearing masks are doing better with regards to coronavirus. At the very least, it seems like a good hypothesis.

Re: How South Korea Reined In The Outbreak Without Shutting Everything Down

#123

Post by brutt »

mantas wrote: post #73
throwaway_pdp09 wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Wearing mask discourages you from touching your face with your hands Good point! > If someone sneezes at you, even most simple mask will stop at least 50% of viruses sounds plausible, but any reference for that figure?

That's what is posted in our local media. I'm not sure if it comes from local gov agencies or WHO or something else. FFP2 / N95 respirators - 90-something percent, medical "blue" masks - 80 percent, home-made piece-of-cloth style ~ 50%. Wearing sunglasses is encouraged too. Both to stop the load if someone sneezes at you and discourage from touching your eyes.

N95 - 95% at least.

Medical mask - 96,4%.

Home made mask - 60-96% (depends on cloth and sewing).

https://www.researchgate.net/publication/258525804_Testing_t...

Re: How South Korea Reined In The Outbreak Without Shutting Everything Down

#124

Post by i_am_proteus »

Kiro wrote: post #115
raaaaraaaa12 wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We have face mask mandatory now in Czech Republic, Italy scared us and goverment reacted quickly. Its not over yet but we are on the right track. https://news.expats.cz/health-medical/breaking-face-covering...

How does that work when it's impossible to buy masks anywhere?

A t-shirt or bandana or scarf will make an excellent makeshift mask. This is not the equivalent of an N95 mask that should be used by health care professionals, but is good for ordinary citizens in public.

Re: How South Korea Reined In The Outbreak Without Shutting Everything Down

#125

Post by danmaz74 »

Roritharr wrote: post #118
ValentineC wrote: post #112

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> In all the countries mentioned in the article people wear masks when in public, often just against pollution (i.e. Thailand). Singapore resident here. Not enough people are wearing masks in Singapore, and the government has only distributed a token 4 masks per household (family members living at the same address), with no further measures to allow a family to replenish their mask supply. A lot of us can't buy new o…

German resident here, our chief virologist that everyone listens to, Christian Drosten, was firmly against mask usage in the common population, until just now, the RKI was similarly unhelpful when communicating advice for the disease. The population is completely confused and feel righteous anger now telling people off when they wear professional (medical disposable, or ffp3/n95) masks to go shopping or elsewhere. It…

I don't know about that expert, but the reason I usually hear about not using masks is so that health professionals could get them - ie, the problem is that supply isn't currently enough for everybody, and we should prioritise those for which it's most helpful.

Re: How South Korea Reined In The Outbreak Without Shutting Everything Down

#126

Post by simonsarris »

adventured wrote: post #6

So have Thailand, the Philippines and Indonesia (440 million people). They've all had fewer cases than Luxembourg so far. I've yet to see a good explanation for it, other than maybe the premise about seasonal temps and humidity (northern vs southern hemisphere). There's no evidence they're massively lying about their numbers (which would show up in the form of a demolished hospital system and thousands dead of pneumo…

I have wondered that for a while, especially since countries like Malaysia had outbreaks long before Italy. Originally I thought: https://simonsarris.com/sunlight (note: data last updated March 16)

But there are several axes that could matter just as much as quarantine/lockdowns: Humidity, sunlight (as proxy for vitamin D levels, or simply UV), pollution (which also affects sunlight), median age (47 in Italy, 30 in Malaysia, that's huge), and mask use.

Bergamo has low sunshine in Feb and March comparatively. Places hard hit, and their average sunshine on selected months:

* Wuhan: 100 (In Feb)

* Paris: 79-129 (Feb-March, North France harder it by # of cases, cannot find death info)

* Bergamo Italy: 100-150 (Feb-March average)

* Seattle WA: 100-150 (Feb-March)

* Iran sunshine varies a lot by locale. But some places like Rasht, its very low light: 90, 78, 71, 113 for Jan, Feb, Mar, April

Places less hard hit:

* Bangkok 250-275 (Feb-March)

* Kuala Lumpur 185, 192, 208 (Jan Feb March)

* Ho Chi Minh City, 272 (March)

* Seoul: 175-200 (Feb-March) South Korea contained it of course, but their lethality numbers are also lower, and its the lethality that I find odd in all this.

Re: How South Korea Reined In The Outbreak Without Shutting Everything Down

#127

Post by krab »

Kiro wrote: post #115
raaaaraaaa12 wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We have face mask mandatory now in Czech Republic, Italy scared us and goverment reacted quickly. Its not over yet but we are on the right track. https://news.expats.cz/health-medical/breaking-face-covering...

How does that work when it's impossible to buy masks anywhere?

A lot of people was/is sewing them at home. My wife (data scientist in a normal life) made some for our family incl. grandparents and also for some neighbours. A link from a local "Etsy" [1].

The government even made an exception so the sewing supplies shops could open.

[1]: https://www.fler.cz/zbozi/oboustranna-rouska-11339514

Re: How South Korea Reined In The Outbreak Without Shutting Everything Down

#128

Post by Roritharr »

danmaz74 wrote: post #125
Roritharr wrote: post #118

Earlier quoted context omitted.

German resident here, our chief virologist that everyone listens to, Christian Drosten, was firmly against mask usage in the common population, until just now, the RKI was similarly unhelpful when communicating advice for the disease. The population is completely confused and feel righteous anger now telling people off when they wear professional (medical disposable, or ffp3/n95) masks to go shopping or elsewhere. It…

I don't know about that expert, but the reason I usually hear about not using masks is so that health professionals could get them - ie, the problem is that supply isn't currently enough for everybody, and we should prioritise those for which it's most helpful.

That makes total sense, but the communication discouraged people from wearing any kind of mask, even self-made ones.

Re: How South Korea Reined In The Outbreak Without Shutting Everything Down

#129

Post by School-Cotton »

Zigurd wrote: post #39
angarg12 wrote: post #3

I think comparing Singapore, a tiny, highly urbanized island nation, with the US, a continent size country with a vast number of points of entry, is a little bit apples to oranges. Don't get me wrong, I do think that some Asian countries took great measures to contain the virus, and some western countries failed to do so, but I doubt the same measures would be equally as effective everywhere. This is relevant because…

Arguments like this are a longstanding template to excuse everything from crappy broadband to poor health outcomes in general. Yes, America is big, but bits don't get tired in long fiber links, and health care outcomes are independent of distance. America needs to start examining why we lag in so many quality of life issues.

The real reason is just that the US is not as highly developed as the most highly developed countries in Western Europe or East Asia.

I always thought it was weird when people say things like “the US is the worst in the developed world on so many measures!” A bit like someone saying “I’m one of the shortest people in the world who’s 180cm or taller”.

Re: How South Korea Reined In The Outbreak Without Shutting Everything Down

#130

Post by largespoon »

Kiro wrote: post #115
raaaaraaaa12 wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We have face mask mandatory now in Czech Republic, Italy scared us and goverment reacted quickly. Its not over yet but we are on the right track. https://news.expats.cz/health-medical/breaking-face-covering...

How does that work when it's impossible to buy masks anywhere?

Try aliexepress
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