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Private client-side-only PWAs are hard, but now Apple made them impossible

andregarzia.com

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Re: Private client-side-only PWAs are hard, but now Apple made them impossible

#61

Post by IvanK_net »

diggan wrote: post #48
IvanK_net wrote: post #32

It is related only to WebKit (Safari). So I think people will just switch to other browsers.

Except for iPhones/iPads where you don't really have a choice. Also most people don't give a shit which browser they use, they just use whatever browser is available when they get their device, which makes sense. But those users might soon have their data removed without really understanding why.

So I guess more people will switch from iOS to other devices.

I am the creator of a photo editor www.Photopea.com and I see, that more and more people care about their browsers. They spend a lot of time discussing the issues of their browser with me, because they need to do a serious work in it.

Re: Private client-side-only PWAs are hard, but now Apple made them impossible

#63

Post by tssva »

im3w1l wrote: post #56
vbezhenar wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

User not coming to website 7 days can't be invalid use-case. Losing important data simply because someone went on vacation is unacceptable.

So store this data on the server.

The original comment referenced an app where the users are offline for weeks at a time. Storing data on a server is not really possible in this use case.

Re: Private client-side-only PWAs are hard, but now Apple made them impossible

#64

Post by nradov »

bg0 wrote: post #5

I really appreciate this link. I would have never seen this otherwise. It's kind of a disappointment for us on the enterprise side. Our main offering is an offline app where people are disconnected from the internet for weeks and we use localStorage to validate who they are. It's a bit vague about how this affects apps that don't use safari. Nevertheless, we might have to start to really think about the user experien…

Have you considered porting to a native application?

Re: Private client-side-only PWAs are hard, but now Apple made them impossible

#65

Post by conroydave »

DagAgren wrote: post #21
fierarul wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But browsers are severely sandboxed already. What the article is talking about is: > deleting all local storage (including Indexed DB, etc.) after 7 days which I can see how it might help privacy (since you could be tracked via local storage too) but also how it might break any potential web app that might need data to last more than 7 days. > If you want more access, make a native app But then, everybody will compla…

They do not "change from one week to another". They have changed, what, twice ever?

and to be honest the process has gotten a lot easier.

Re: Private client-side-only PWAs are hard, but now Apple made them impossible

#66

Post by vbezhenar »

MaxBarraclough wrote: post #3

As the article explains, Offline Web App is being used to mean Progressive Web Application (the standard terminology). ( edit Turns out that's not quite right, see diggan's reply.) From the article: > You’d almost think they had an App Store to promote or something. There's certainly a tension here. I'm still not sure why more vendors don't make iOS PWAs to get around the App Store payment rules. Perhaps related: Ver…

> I'm still not sure why more vendors don't make iOS PWAs to get around the App Store payment rules.

One reason is because Apple have incentive to break PWAs and they will do it. It's not a wise business decision to act against big player.

Re: Private client-side-only PWAs are hard, but now Apple made them impossible

#67

Post by Aardwolf »

vanderZwan wrote: post #6

I would be OK with 7 days being the default with a permission model where I can grant a website longer storage time. Actually, I'd be even happier if any form of offline storage required explicit user permission anyway.

> Actually, I'd be even happier if any form of offline storage required explicit user permission anyway.

Even offline storage that is only used locally? Say a game with savegames that has doesn't use online connection to play it.

Another example: a password manager.

Re: Private client-side-only PWAs are hard, but now Apple made them impossible

#68

Post by barnabee »

brazzy wrote: post #25
marcosdumay wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's no balance. You just let the user set any permission and make the prompts unobtrusive.

There is no such thing as an "unobtrusive" prompt.

Some browsers show an icon in the address bar when an app is requesting/can make use of an optional permission or feature. Clicking the icon allows you do grant the extra permission (i.e. allow cookies, enable, camera, etc.) but otherwise no additional prompt is shown.

I think this is an excellent example of such an unobtrusive prompt and is how ALL such features should be implemented. Sites should get almost no permissions by default and certainly not be able to show popup prompts.

Re: Private client-side-only PWAs are hard, but now Apple made them impossible

#69

Post by heynk »

I'm an engineer at a platform that makes it easier to build privacy-friendly apps. This means that all apps on our platform have app-specific private keys stored on the client side (in localStorage), and they never touch a server.

With this change, you're essentially "logged out" after 7 days of inactivity.

This is pretty a bad user experience. I honestly am not sure how to mitigate this. MacOS Safari might not be a massive market, but iOS Safari is.

Any thoughts about how we should address this change?

Re: Private client-side-only PWAs are hard, but now Apple made them impossible

#70

Post by true_religion »

From the article...

> Heck, they could even go further and ban apps from corporations like Facebook, Inc., and Alphabet, Inc., that have violating your privacy as the core tenet of their business model.

If Apple were to ban the Gmail app (and obviously block web access via iOS too because that would be a loophole otherwise), I would throw away my iPhone, swear off business with Apple, and search dearly for a way to sue them.

I don’t love the walled garden iOS represents, I merely live with it in exchange for great hardware and UX. If the bargain changes to be more restrictive, I would turn against it in a heartbeat.

Thinking about that, is no surprise Apple is striking out early to make web apps useless. If they wait too long, they will become entrenched, and people will feel like they have lost something if access is restricted. Apple really wants to jealously protect its control, and more importantly ability to take 30% tax of every transaction that they can perceive.

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