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Taiwan's new 'electronic fence' for quarantines leads wave of virus monitoring

reuters.com

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Re: Taiwan's new 'electronic fence' for quarantines leads wave of virus monitoring

#121

Post by derefr »

barkingcat wrote: post #45
bobbyd3 wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How did they get your information for the daily call? Just curious. Is everyone required to submit contact information? Or did they already have the required contact info for daily health checkups?

There is a national registry - if you have a birth certificate, if you have a passport, if you file taxes, if you've used a government service (ever), if you visited dentist/doctor at any point in your life, they have linked those records. If you are visitor and if they need to, within a few hours of landing at an airport and arriving at your destination, you will get a phone call at your destination location/hotel,…

> the authorities will call the number you put on that card to see if you're there or if you've checked into the hotel

So... what happens when you’re not there? I.e. if the government just can’t find you? Does this then translate to a police APB or something?

Re: Taiwan's new 'electronic fence' for quarantines leads wave of virus monitoring

#122

Post by bobbylarrybobby »

lifeformed wrote: post #32

I'm in Taiwan in day 6 of home quarantine right now. We get a call every morning to check up on our health. I don't mind it, it's a simple and effective method and it gives me confidence in the government and society, knowing that everyone is taking the situation seriously. Once I'm out of quarantine, I can feel comfortable being outside living a normal life, knowing that all known potential carriers are contained.

Just want to say the Dustforce soundtrack is one my favorite video game soundtracks of all time

Re: Taiwan's new 'electronic fence' for quarantines leads wave of virus monitoring

#123

Post by philliphaydon »

jlokier wrote: post #110
bilal4hmed wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Permanent Residence thats good. Rules are rules, especially in these times.

That's terrible. PR is supposed to be "more or less a citizen, now stay for long enough and you can become a citizen". Not "we'll call it permanent but it doesn't mean anything". Rules means justice and enforcement too. You're not supposed to have a different justice system for people on PR than for citizens. They should have jailed the person, if that's what they do to citizens, or done whatever else they do to citi…

Not at all. You still need to renew your PR status over time. It's only permanent in the sense that if you are free to live in the country without needing to be sponsored by someone (company or individual). It's still a visa at the end of the day.

If you're on an EP / WP which is then cancelled you have 30 days to get a new visa or leave the country.

PR != Citizenship in any shape or form.

Re: Taiwan's new 'electronic fence' for quarantines leads wave of virus monitoring

#124

Post by nopinsight »

hanspedah wrote: post #91
candu wrote: post #80

Earlier quoted context omitted.

...except that, in said dark ages, that got people executed for treason or witchcraft or what have you. Here, it could very well save lives. Many democratic governments have tried voluntary restrictions - some people are complying, but others don't seem to care. What else is there but to enforce those restrictions via previously existing channels (e.g. Quarantine Act in Canada)? IMHO, this is similar to reporting som…

It not only could but it saves lives, I'm not disputing that. But the question is at what cost to the individual, the society, the economy and their future. What happens if the economy crashes? Is it reasonable and the price worth paying? We should be allowed to not only ask these questions but discuss them.

Even in economic terms, the cost of say 5 hospitalizations from infections down the road is much, much greater than the utility these people enjoy from a house party.

Obviously, the value of a life is greater still.

I’m arguing in your terms but I don’t think economics is exactly the right framework for this decision.

Re: Taiwan's new 'electronic fence' for quarantines leads wave of virus monitoring

#125

Post by [deleted] »

robjan wrote: post #119
qwerty456127 wrote: post #94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What about the rest of the time? Is it easy to live without a phone in Taiwan? Can you buy a non-locked phone and a prepaid SIM card anonymously?

Only if it's an a SIM purchased from abroad. You need to produce a form of national ID if you want to purchase a SIM in Taiwan.

[deleted]

Re: Taiwan's new 'electronic fence' for quarantines leads wave of virus monitoring

#126

Post by x0ul »

qwerty456127 wrote: post #94
flyt wrote: post #89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Then don't travel to Taiwan for a few months.

What about the rest of the time? Is it easy to live without a phone in Taiwan? Can you buy a non-locked phone and a prepaid SIM card anonymously?

It's fairly easy to live without a phone in Taiwan. It's not like China. Most payments in Taiwan are made with cash, EasyCard (or equivalent, depending on the city. It's a prepaid metro card you can use at some stores) or a credit card. Mobile payments tied to your identity (eg. WeChat) are not the norm. You can also use an EasyCard without providing a phone number but then you cannot rent bicycles or recover the funds if you lose your card.

Re: Taiwan's new 'electronic fence' for quarantines leads wave of virus monitoring

#127

Post by refurb »

jlokier wrote: post #110
bilal4hmed wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Permanent Residence thats good. Rules are rules, especially in these times.

That's terrible. PR is supposed to be "more or less a citizen, now stay for long enough and you can become a citizen". Not "we'll call it permanent but it doesn't mean anything". Rules means justice and enforcement too. You're not supposed to have a different justice system for people on PR than for citizens. They should have jailed the person, if that's what they do to citizens, or done whatever else they do to citi…

The US does the exact same thing. If you have a green card and you commit a felony, there is a very good chance you'll loss PR status and get deported.

Re: Taiwan's new 'electronic fence' for quarantines leads wave of virus monitoring

#128

Post by CliffStoll »

beefok wrote: post #81
lifeformed wrote: post #32

I'm in Taiwan in day 6 of home quarantine right now. We get a call every morning to check up on our health. I don't mind it, it's a simple and effective method and it gives me confidence in the government and society, knowing that everyone is taking the situation seriously. Once I'm out of quarantine, I can feel comfortable being outside living a normal life, knowing that all known potential carriers are contained.

That sounds like the way forward, I wish things were working out that way here! (USA) Off-topic but, I just discovered your music on spotify a few weeks ago and can't stop listening to your albums, amazing stuff man!

Yes!

Re: Taiwan's new 'electronic fence' for quarantines leads wave of virus monitoring

#129

Post by state_less »

Gustomaximus wrote: post #120
state_less wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And if not permanent, more common. Authorities might say, "We did it before and this flu is half as dangerous, so just to be safe, let's put everyone on the digital leash again." This sort control comes with its own costs. Personally, I'd rather take my risks and live free.

This is why democracy is so important. It is the pressure valve to excess. Sure some government will abuse this type of feature but there will be a point where people push back. Maybe not soon enough for initial abuse but eventually.

It might be possible to get a majority to vote away their right to unreasonable search, but the courts shouldn't allow it. If there is a rule to not congregate, then send the police out to these public places and write up tickets. Pay whistleblowers to report workplace violations (reasonable cause) and so on.

The German approach mentioned above is better in my view. I believe we can find ways to be effective and protect people's civil rights.

Re: Taiwan's new 'electronic fence' for quarantines leads wave of virus monitoring

#130

Post by ivalm »

hanspedah wrote: post #91
candu wrote: post #80

Earlier quoted context omitted.

...except that, in said dark ages, that got people executed for treason or witchcraft or what have you. Here, it could very well save lives. Many democratic governments have tried voluntary restrictions - some people are complying, but others don't seem to care. What else is there but to enforce those restrictions via previously existing channels (e.g. Quarantine Act in Canada)? IMHO, this is similar to reporting som…

It not only could but it saves lives, I'm not disputing that. But the question is at what cost to the individual, the society, the economy and their future. What happens if the economy crashes? Is it reasonable and the price worth paying? We should be allowed to not only ask these questions but discuss them.

Can't have livelihood if you aren't alive!
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