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Things you can do with a browser in 2020

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Re: Things you can do with a browser in 2020

#261

Post by onion2k »

GuiA wrote: post #188
untog wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Then you're out of step with what users want these days. Nothing wrong with that! But to take an example, when I hit a share button on a page I want to see the native share box, not some hideous iframed monstrosity that only works with Facebook. So I want Web Share. And I don't want to download an entire native app just so that I can receive a push alert when my food order is on the way, a web site works much better…

"As a user, I don't want this" seems like a reasonable claim. "Then you don't know what other people want" doesn't seem like a reasonable response. People want a lot of things - but only use what they can access. Additionally, people will deliberately choose to use broken/painful systems if they have to, in order to accomplish a broader goal. Finally, the vast majority of systems used by users are built because they…

"As a user I don't want this" is reasonable.

"As a user I don't want this therefore no one else should have it either." is a bit less reasonable, and implies that you don't know what other users want or care about what they need.

Re: Things you can do with a browser in 2020

#264

Post by wtallis »

onion2k wrote: post #258
dgellow wrote: post #252

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Then you're out of step with what users want these days. Two things: 1. The person you respond to is also a user, no reason to dismiss their point of view 2. I don’t think browsers asked users for what they want! It’s a bit disingenuous to say “that’s what users want” when the communication is one way only.

Try talking to some developer relations people from the Google Web team, Mozzila, Microsoft etc. They're all very receptive to feature requests. It absolutely isn't a one way street.

How are feature requests from web developers to browser vendors evidence that browser vendors are paying attention to the desires of end users?

Re: Things you can do with a browser in 2020

#265

Post by onion2k »

wtallis wrote: post #264
onion2k wrote: post #258

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Try talking to some developer relations people from the Google Web team, Mozzila, Microsoft etc. They're all very receptive to feature requests. It absolutely isn't a one way street.

How are feature requests from web developers to browser vendors evidence that browser vendors are paying attention to the desires of end users ?

The evidence is that the end users use these things when they're implemented in browsers and web developers adopt them in their apps.

Re: Things you can do with a browser in 2020

#266

Post by arc-in-space »

gwern wrote: post #11
_bxg1 wrote: post #6

Worth noting is that "prefers-color-scheme" works in all major OSes at this point, mobile and desktop. If your site already has a dark theme, there is no reason at all not to be integrating it this way. Even if you don't have a dark theme already, it's a huge value-add..... (@dang?)

Yes, it's such an obscure feature that many of the people who enable it don't even realize it... Ever since I added dark mode to gwern.net, I've been getting or seeing complaints about how my website is broken or 'defaults to black-on-white' (it doesn't). :(

hey gwern, I personally really appreciate the dark mode support.

Re: Things you can do with a browser in 2020

#267

Post by mrwww »

rkagerer wrote: post #28

As a user, so many of these I wish did NOT exist. E.g: Push Notifications, Banners, Web Share, Contacts, Page Visibility, Badging. Uncertain about USB, Bluetooth, Locks, Keyboard Lock, and Native File System. I don't want my browser doing those things.

So many sites ask you for notification permission on first visit in a very spammy way. Or, put their "share this" in a spammy/ad-like location. and i think that's the problem, web site owners being dumb and pushy.

If there is a site you really like, that you want to share, and would want to recieve pertinent updates from, if you so choose without being hounded to do so, aren't you happy the feature is there?

When I implement this that's how I think anyway.

Re: Things you can do with a browser in 2020

#268

Post by 3xblah »

rkagerer wrote: post #28

As a user, so many of these I wish did NOT exist. E.g: Push Notifications, Banners, Web Share, Contacts, Page Visibility, Badging. Uncertain about USB, Bluetooth, Locks, Keyboard Lock, and Native File System. I don't want my browser doing those things.

Surely it was browser users who demanded such "features", right?

The browser I use the most does not do any of these things, but it does a nice job of dumping HTML tables to formatted text, which is something the modern graphical browsers cannot do..

Re: Things you can do with a browser in 2020

#269

Post by pjmorris »

onion2k wrote: post #265
wtallis wrote: post #264

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How are feature requests from web developers to browser vendors evidence that browser vendors are paying attention to the desires of end users ?

The evidence is that the end users use these things when they're implemented in browsers and web developers adopt them in their apps.

I promise that I have never asked for a notification or a pop-up. They 'work' from the point of view of web sites and browser vendors, maybe more so than from the perspective of users.

Re: Things you can do with a browser in 2020

#270

Post by chinesempire »

zzo38computer wrote: post #228
asjw wrote: post #134

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Chat is probably one of the only functionalities that are still better served by an ad-hoc app If you need notifications, just use a native app (or even a web one wrapped in a native app) Anyway, most of these "features" are used because they are already there, remove them from the base install of the browser, distribute them as a plugin and make the devs consider that the feature could not be present and they will s…

> Chat is probably one of the only functionalities that are still better served by an ad-hoc app Yes, actually, IRC works better for chat, I think. Actually, it is probably true of some other stuff too, such as many kind of multiplayer games; you could use a telnet (or SSH) session.

I guess you're trying to be sarcastic, but it's not working
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