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Things you can do with a browser in 2020

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Re: Things you can do with a browser in 2020

#241

Post by zzo38computer »

hombre_fatal wrote: post #126
gowld wrote: post #111

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What's wrong with native app? You can delete it when you are done with it, just like you can close a browser tab when you are done with the "entire" web app you downloaded.

No uBlock, no dev console, no network tab. Completely opaque. An install step just to order a pizza. Shareable URLs/deeplinks. It's a freak of luck that we have the web, an app environment with a built-in dev console and actual customization. Just think how much it contrasts with the black box of native apps and with what large companies actually want. I'm in no rush to throw it away.

Yes, but why should you need such a complicated system at all just to order a pizza, whether it needs an install step or not? A simple form, telephone call, etc would do.

Re: Things you can do with a browser in 2020

#242

Post by eru »

rkagerer wrote: post #28

As a user, so many of these I wish did NOT exist. E.g: Push Notifications, Banners, Web Share, Contacts, Page Visibility, Badging. Uncertain about USB, Bluetooth, Locks, Keyboard Lock, and Native File System. I don't want my browser doing those things.

> I don't want my browser doing those things.

Your browser should let you decide whether you give websites access to this functionality?

Re: Things you can do with a browser in 2020

#243

Post by JadeNB »

monkin wrote: post #197
untog wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Then you're out of step with what users want these days. Nothing wrong with that! But to take an example, when I hit a share button on a page I want to see the native share box, not some hideous iframed monstrosity that only works with Facebook. So I want Web Share. And I don't want to download an entire native app just so that I can receive a push alert when my food order is on the way, a web site works much better…

> Then you're out of step with what users want these days. "Developers" or average Joe's? Most people I know don't know what push notifications are. RSS? "Some kind of gov agency?". Sharing? "Facebook button!". And, no, they aren't idiots, they just don't care and see any of that. ;)

> "Developers" or average Joe's? Most people I know don't know what push notifications are. RSS? "Some kind of gov agency?". Sharing? "Facebook button!". And, no, they aren't idiots, they just don't care and see any of that. ;)

I think this leaves out a middle ground. The people who design web pages love this stuff, either business decision-makers (because they think it improves metrics) or programmers (because it's a cool way to implement the area of their technological expertise)—but you can be a techie, know exactly what all these things are, and not want them.

(RSS is a funny one to see on the list. It's practically ancient, and most browsers seem to have given up on integrating it—which is a shame, because it's a low-flash solution to a real problem and is user-centered and -controlled.)

Re: Things you can do with a browser in 2020

#244

Post by vthriller »

p1necone wrote: post #223
eeZah7Ux wrote: post #142

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Despite the idiotic downvotes, you are absolutely right. Browsers are terrible. No other applications or OS components are so monolithic expose the same attack surface.

What? Running a native desktop app exposes a much larger attack surface than opening a webpage.

> native desktop app exposes a much larger attack surface

If we're talking about code executed as a result of, say, buffer overflow attacks, then the impact is the same both for the native app and for the browser. The latter, however, has way much more places where that overflow could happen! And they still happen, security updates for the browsers get pushed all the time.

(And we're not even talking about the world of XSS/CSRF attacks here! Those are pretty much exclusive to the browsers, and widen the attack surface tremendously.)

Re: Things you can do with a browser in 2020

#245

Post by xmprt »

zzo38computer wrote: post #241
hombre_fatal wrote: post #126

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No uBlock, no dev console, no network tab. Completely opaque. An install step just to order a pizza. Shareable URLs/deeplinks. It's a freak of luck that we have the web, an app environment with a built-in dev console and actual customization. Just think how much it contrasts with the black box of native apps and with what large companies actually want. I'm in no rush to throw it away.

Yes, but why should you need such a complicated system at all just to order a pizza, whether it needs an install step or not? A simple form, telephone call, etc would do.

Simple systems work great and are easy to implement when you're working with limited requirements. But the second you start to add new features, the system breaks down. How would a simple form or telephone call work if I wanted to know the status of the pizza or delivery driver's location?

I'd prefer not to give my number to them because then they can send me unsolicited "offers" all the time (just look at email) but I don't want to block them either because I still like their pizza.

Re: Things you can do with a browser in 2020

#247

Post by girvo »

taeric wrote: post #230
untog wrote: post #208

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Is this a thing that happens often? Used to, your phone number was in a publicly available book. When you could only call that number. Messaging is pretty different. And sure it happens! Phone numbers are (nearly) immutable. It's a valuable piece of personal information. Your web push ID is... not.

I still get more robo calls on landlines than on my cell. Conveniently, my cell is in a different area code from where I live, so even easy to spot the bad ones. And I have never gotten an unsolicited text. That wasn't a wrong number.

I’ve gotten plenty, just for a counter-anecdote. In fact I received one today!

Re: Things you can do with a browser in 2020

#249

Post by Stratoscope »

taeric wrote: post #181
untog wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Then you're out of step with what users want these days. Nothing wrong with that! But to take an example, when I hit a share button on a page I want to see the native share box, not some hideous iframed monstrosity that only works with Facebook. So I want Web Share. And I don't want to download an entire native app just so that I can receive a push alert when my food order is on the way, a web site works much better…

I prefer copying the link to the page I'm on to share. No popups, native or otherwise. Similarly, I like not having an app running so that you could just send me a text. Sms is bad for security, but great see sending short notifications. Almost better, as it is so limited.

> I prefer copying the link to the page I'm on to share. No popups, native or otherwise.

I tend to agree, but this puts us both in the 5% of internet users who know how to do that. (And no, I'm not celebrating that low number.)

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