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Why N95 masks are hard to make

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Re: Why N95 masks are hard to make

#221

Post by agustif »

kevin_thibedeau wrote: post #146
ardit33 wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Rome was a "superpower" militarily but it couldn't feed itself, and had to rely on grain from Egypt and the fertile crescent to feed its population..... Here we can't produce some basic silly things... as it is not that economical during normal times... Perhaps farming subsides are not a crazy type of idea after all.

Farming subsidies for food. Not a bad idea. Subsidizing overproduction of ethanol is another issue.

On france you have their biggest billionaire owner of some big brand names reconverting all it's factories to produce that stuff

Re: Why N95 masks are hard to make

#222

Post by krillkkl »

tlrobinson wrote: post #119
arcticbull wrote: post #112

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't understand why we insist on keeping people in jobs that can be automated. Let them go pursue something that's fulfilling. Not automating something that can be just to keep people doing jobs we don't need done is a fascinating make-work project. The displaced should be re-trained, provided meaningful opportunities, or yeah, paid basic income out of the money saved by them not going to work. Why pay them to do…

I’m not saying we should protect these jobs by law or anything, but I question whether work that can be automated can't be fulfilling. I keep seeing these “Cafe X” robotic coffee bars in San Francisco. Surely some baristas find their job fulfilling, and some customers enjoy chatting with their human barista instead of a robot? Personally I think I’d have a hard time feeling good about working on something that direct…

> I’m not saying we should protect these jobs by law or anything, but I question whether work that can be automated can't be fulfilling.

Thanks for writing this, I don't think it gets said often enough (or at all).

Re: Why N95 masks are hard to make

#223

Post by makomk »

snowwrestler wrote: post #68
_2d30 wrote: post #13

I do believe these masks are also made in the US, but this situation highlights exactly why a country having its own major manufacturing base is not just an economic need but rather also a national security need. The US needs to invest in itself immediately to rebuild its lost manufacturing base. In economic terms, under certain definitions and assumptions that are typical under modern economics, a trade war such as…

No country has the manufacturing base to meet the demand for these masks under a pandemic, not even China. That’s what the article is all about. Your thoughts on the merits of trade wars are not applicable.

The US is having trouble making enough masks to meet its normal day-to-day demand for them, let alone the increase from a pandemic, because almost all the mask production has been outsourced to China and they're redirecting the entire output to local use. That's an issue and it's a reason why the US might want extremely substantial tariffs or even quotas on mask imports in normal circumstances.

Re: Why N95 masks are hard to make

#224

Post by tough »

sgift wrote: post #204
tomp wrote: post #164

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You saw what happened in the EU. No borders but also no shared decision-making and responsibility. It quickly deteriorated to a situation worse than in the US, with each country doing its own thing (including closing most borders), and very little cooperation and helping each other. Trump might not be making the best decisions, but at least he's making decisions for the US! Noone is even trying to make decisions for…

> Noone is even trying to make decisions for Europe... Of course people are. The EU commission works on it, countries talk to each other. Is there a fully coordinated EU response yet? No. Is there cooperation? Yes.

Well our female president Von Der Leyen snatched up a 80mill grant for cureVac in order to avoid Trump luring them to move and secure the covid-19 vaccine for US only.

Trump 0 Europe 1

Re: Why N95 masks are hard to make

#225

Post by Seanambers »

piva00 wrote: post #199
Paperweight wrote: post #173

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Highly-automated, "clean" manufacturing is all well and good for billion-dollar highly-capitalized, politically-sheltered megafactories, but what about the other 90% of manufacturers? Manufacturing is a dirty, dangerous, manual business. I think the small guys will tell you that environmental regulations killed manufacturing in the west, not labour costs. We've been living in lala land with it all offshore, out of si…

Tell that to Germany, stricter environmental regulations and a very healthy, highly developed manufacturing sector. They might not have all of their supply chain made locally but Germany makes the machines that makes machines so if needed they could ramp up their internal manufacturing quite quickly, doesn't seem to be the case for the US.

Well Germany has been so fortunate as to be a member of a currency union, where they are the leading industrial base, thus giving them a artificial low currency as an advantage as well. This helps manufacturing quit a bit.

Re: Why N95 masks are hard to make

#226

Post by leereeves »

jdietrich wrote: post #155
echelon wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

All the workers being replaced by automation and having to rely on "gig economy" work could pursue manufacturing instead. We have the workforce. We can pay workers livable wages and give them meaningful work. Cost of goods could be reduced through greater efficiency. Research into robotics and automation could fuel a new decade of American growth.

>We have the workforce. That's the problem - you don't. By definition, the kind of efficient, highly-automated manufacturing you're thinking of doesn't need many unskilled or semi-skilled workers, but it does need skilled and experienced engineers and machinists. It needs a massive and complex ecosystem of suppliers and support. The depletion of America's industrial base has created a massive skills gap that would ta…

> The depletion of America's industrial base has created a massive skills gap that would take decades to remedy

All the more reason to get started immediately.

Re: Why N95 masks are hard to make

#227

Post by Engineering-MD »

tim333 wrote: post #205
doodlebugging wrote: post #108

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I had considered the metal parts of the mask to be a potential problem. In the worst case scenario it should be relatively simple for mask owners to remove the metal tab from the nose and the staples holding the elastic bands before microwaving. Once they are done in the microwave the bands could be stapled in place with your ordinary stapler and the band reattached with hot glue. Those who have a needle and thread c…

Apparently salt on the mask kills viruses https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2017/01/170105160228.h... https://www.businessinsider.com/mask-coated-in-salt-neutrali... I was going to DIY. Soak in brine then dry the thing.

I believe it also recommends the addition of a surfactant to make small crystals and a more even coating

Re: Why N95 masks are hard to make

#228

Post by imtringued »

Seanambers wrote: post #225
piva00 wrote: post #199

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Tell that to Germany, stricter environmental regulations and a very healthy, highly developed manufacturing sector. They might not have all of their supply chain made locally but Germany makes the machines that makes machines so if needed they could ramp up their internal manufacturing quite quickly, doesn't seem to be the case for the US.

Well Germany has been so fortunate as to be a member of a currency union, where they are the leading industrial base, thus giving them a artificial low currency as an advantage as well. This helps manufacturing quit a bit.

That's completely insignificant compared to having the dollar as the global currency in the oil trade. Countries that sell oil for dollar can only spend those dollars on American products. It's as if the USA produced all the oil in the world and sold it for profit. Meanwhile Germany's unfair advantage is that it's prices on products are slightly lower than they should be.

Re: Why N95 masks are hard to make

#229

Post by kilroy123 »

gauravjain13 wrote: post #182
jdietrich wrote: post #155

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>We have the workforce. That's the problem - you don't. By definition, the kind of efficient, highly-automated manufacturing you're thinking of doesn't need many unskilled or semi-skilled workers, but it does need skilled and experienced engineers and machinists. It needs a massive and complex ecosystem of suppliers and support. The depletion of America's industrial base has created a massive skills gap that would ta…

This, exactly. America has manufacturing talent, but not at the scale required for a manufacturing economy. (Source: ~2 decades in global manufacturing.)

So what can we do as a nation to change that? Should we even try at this point?

Re: Why N95 masks are hard to make

#230

Post by nieksand »

bitL wrote: post #81
bootlooped wrote: post #76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"(N95) Masks won't protect you" was an expedient lie. How can it be that medical professionals are in dire need of N95 masks to protect them from the virus, yet they are powerless to do any good in the hands of the public? https://www.nytimes.com/2020/03/17/opinion/coronavirus-face-... If everybody in the US could wear one of these when out in public, we would be in a much better place. The sad truth is we don't have…

N95 is not a surgical mask. That one is a professional respirator. Yet infection can enter via eyes, so one has to wear airtight glasses as well to be sure. Surgical mask looks like this: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Surgical_mask There is no respirator embedded as you can see, it's just a simple piece of fabric. The point of my original reply was that we could reduce R0/transmission rate only if everybody had to we…

Which EU countries? I have not heard this before.
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