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NPM Is Joining GitHub

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Re: NPM Is Joining GitHub

#291

Post by mizzao »

throwaway78359 wrote: post #232

Microsoftie here — throwaway for obvious reasons. Microsoft doesn’t do everything right but the GitHub acquisition has honestly gone better than I ever expected. Rather than forcing GitHub to adopt Microsoft centric policies, Microsoft has adopted more GitHub stuff, especially from a product POV. GitHub still runs as a separate company (different logins and health care and hiring systems) with its own policies and po…

> Google and Amazon have the EEE under lock right now

what is EEE?

Re: NPM Is Joining GitHub

#293

Post by K0nserv »

mbesto wrote: post #253
K0nserv wrote: post #185

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It depends on what the alternative is. When NPM starts running out of money to run the service what would happen? More VC, but only to a point and the firms would be increasingly be influencing NPM to make money by any means(probably not good for anyone but the firms). Alternatively a cash strapped NPM fails to invest in security and availability of the service leading to widespread outages or worse a large scale sup…

> It depends on what the alternative is. Ruby Gems, PHP composer, PIP, etc. would all like a word with you.... https://rubygems.org/pages/sponsors https://www.python.org/psf/

That's a path but NPM already being a company with signficant VC investment would a transition to such a model workout with the existing stakeholders? Also NPM is quite a bit bigger than both the Ruby and Python library spaces.

Re: NPM Is Joining GitHub

#294

Post by ddek »

FooBarWidget wrote: post #80
franciscop wrote: post #26

I'm surprised there's not a single mention of "Microsoft" in this or the npm announcement [1], given the old-evil-history of Microsoft and the new-nice Microsoft we have today. I would expect that there was at least a mention, considering the reason that most modules in npm are still in ES5 is exactly because of the monopolistic practices that Microsoft followed back in the day which makes Internet Explorer still rel…

Microsoft is aware of their reputation. So much that they even have a policy of not allowing Microsoft+Github co-brand promotions. They want the Github brand to stay strong instead of being diluted into some mix of Github and Microsoft.

I get this in principal, but when I go to GitHub without being logged in it just feels... well, like Microsoft.

Re: NPM Is Joining GitHub

#295

Post by rch »

epicide wrote: post #154
nixpulvis wrote: post #138

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sleez'n their way into our hearts. I can't say I really blame them, but god I hate it all.

What does a trustworthy Microsoft look like to you?

Three product companies (Enterprise, Consumer, and Media), an open source company (Research, Engineering, and Collaboration), and a foundation owning all of the patents and other licensed IP.

Re: NPM Is Joining GitHub

#296

Post by bad_user »

timrod wrote: post #277
mbesto wrote: post #252

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> NPM being such an important pillar in the software supply chain while having an unviable business model and largely being funded by VC money was never a good position to be in. Why does NPM need to be funded as a commercial entity at all? What other open source library has a private company running its package manager? This one still boggles my mind.

For programming languages, there are several examples of commercially run package managers: - the Java/Kotlin/Scala ecosystem is based around maven central, which is run by Sonatype, Inc. - Go modules are hosted by Google. Previously, most libraries were hosted on Github - Rust's crate index is on Github - The Docker/Moby registry is run by Docker, Inc. (though that might be a stretch for "package manager" :))

Maven Central has mirrors and alternatives and you can trivially host your own repository, all you'd need is a plain web server serving a bunch of static files.

Some libraries aren't hosted on Maven Central actually, so it's not uncommon to see instructions for adding extra resolvers to your build config.

The Java ecosystem isn't as dependent on Maven Central as the JavaScript ecosystem is on npmjs.com

Re: NPM Is Joining GitHub

#297

Post by sylens »

nixpulvis wrote: post #189
epicide wrote: post #154

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What does a trustworthy Microsoft look like to you?

I don't really distrust Microsoft per se. I just find it tragic that the only way GitHub could survive (I guess) was to be BOUGHT. Like why couldn't they stay smaller, focus on what they were good at, and standardize with the community all the integrations in an orderly manner? Although, Microsoft has shown they care more about the developer community than Apple as of late. So for that, I can at least say my trust is…

Microsoft's stance lately is that it's great if you want to run Linux - they want to provide tools for you to use there as well.

Re: NPM Is Joining GitHub

#298

Post by 205guy »

ChuckMcM wrote: post #200
hajile wrote: post #179

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Chapter 7 Bankruptcy where they get acquired by a newly-reformed Sun Microsystems (where no stock is owned by Oracle or Oracle shareholders). EDIT: I'm mostly kidding, but you can't really expect true change of morals when the vast majority of the upper management is the same under the new CEO as under the old one.

As a former Sun employee I love this comment, but in all fairness Sun did have its own level of sleaze in the C suite (neither Eric Schmidt nor Scott McNealy would really do well as ethical leader exemplars) That said, I'm thinking Moon Microsystems :-) Not as big or as hot as Sun. (ok that is a bad punalogy) I did get the domain though, it was available and I couldn't resist.

Under certain conditions, can eclipse the the Sun. "Eclipse" ... now there is a name I haven't heard in a long time.

But can you make a cool logo out of "Moon"?

Re: NPM Is Joining GitHub

#299

Post by threatofrain »

flanbiscuit wrote: post #150

I wonder if more people will look into adopting Deno[1], the new node alternative by one of the creators of Node. It does not use NPM, you pull in packages Go-style (via URLs[2]). It's supposed to be more secure because you have to explicitly give it access to anything (i.e. network, file system, etc). [1] https://deno.land/ [2] example import in Deno: import { serve } from "https://deno.land/std@v0.36.0/http/server.…

Is deno debugging there yet?

Re: NPM Is Joining GitHub

#300

Post by K0nserv »

mulmen wrote: post #240
K0nserv wrote: post #185

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It depends on what the alternative is. When NPM starts running out of money to run the service what would happen? More VC, but only to a point and the firms would be increasingly be influencing NPM to make money by any means(probably not good for anyone but the firms). Alternatively a cash strapped NPM fails to invest in security and availability of the service leading to widespread outages or worse a large scale sup…

This is sad to read. Why does every project have to be profitable? If NPM is useful users (companies and people) can invest time or cash to support the operations and continued development. This foundation model has been successful across open source and prevents one company from changing the direction of a project to fit their own needs at the expense of everyone else. I think this was critical to the continued grow…

To be clear that's not what I am arguing here, I agree that package registries should, ideally, be owned and supported by the community. However NPM already had fairly significnat VC investment and as such any transition to a community supported model would be challenging.

The acquisition can be a good outcome for the current situation without it being the ideal state of things.

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