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Chloroquine phosphate has shown apparent efficacy in treating Covid-19

ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

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Re: Chloroquine phosphate has shown apparent efficacy in treating Covid-19

#41

Post by _-___________-_ »

yorwba wrote: post #37
weekay wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>The outcomes of some current clinical trials of chloroquine in China have been announced, without access to the data. This seems to be the link to the details of clinical trials in China that are made available http://www.chictr.org.cn/searchproj.aspx?title=氯喹&officialna...

I checked the most recent result from that search: http://www.chictr.org.cn/showproj.aspx?proj=50843 At the very bottom, it says "original data will be published on web-based public database in 6 months after the research" which is a bit disappointing.

What would be the motivation for that 6 month delay? Cynically it only seems like a way to grab headlines without any possibility of informed criticism, but I really want to believe that there are other possible motivations!

Re: Chloroquine phosphate has shown apparent efficacy in treating Covid-19

#42

Post by _-___________-_ »

ustamills wrote: post #39

Isn't that the "tonic" in "Gin & Tonic" ?

It's an analogue of quinine, which tonic water nowadays may contain varying (quite small) amounts of, depending on brand etc.

G&Ts almost certainly won't have any effect on your susceptibility to infection nor your prognosis once infected. But they might help with (or make worse?) the anxiety associated with the panic.

Re: Chloroquine phosphate has shown apparent efficacy in treating Covid-19

#44

Post by droopyEyelids »

babayega2 wrote: post #36

In Africa when you suffer from Malaria they gradually give you Chloroquine, Amodiaquine or even Quinine. From my experience, Quinine is the strongest. I grew up taking those medicines. Man. They knock you out. Your ears are no longer working the first 3 days of taking Quinine. You lose the sense of smell. I guess they slow down the Corona 19 virus. My mom has already sent me Amodiaquine and Quinine here in Italy.

Chloroquine encourages cells to take in zinc, zinc inhibits RdRP, RdRP builds copies of viruses.

Thats the mechanism that works in test tubes, but not in humans so far. Pulling Zinc into cells is what determines this hypothetical effect, not to be confused with whatever has the strongest side effects.

Re: Chloroquine phosphate has shown apparent efficacy in treating Covid-19

#45

Post by scarejunba »

saagarjha wrote: post #29
scarejunba wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Then you'll know because I volunteered for it. And I know I won't die because it's already safe enough to fight malaria. But maybe you don't know that. That's fine. I do. Let me arbitrage my knowledge.

> Then you'll know because I volunteered for it. Clinical trials are already fast-tracked during epidemics; if you're really interested you may even be selected for one. But going out and randomly buying medicine because it seems like it might work (even though it might not, but you're cured without it, which means you're going to go out and tell everyone else to go buy it too) might not necessarily be the best way t…

> But going out and randomly buying medicine because it seems like it might work (even though it might not, but you're cured without it, which means you're going to go out and tell everyone else to go buy it too) might not necessarily be the best way to deal with this.

Hey, that's okay, let me live or die on my own terms. It's my body. Stop trying to rule it.

I'm not making you take it. How about you don't make me not take it.

Re: Chloroquine phosphate has shown apparent efficacy in treating Covid-19

#46

Post by rscho »

shoyer wrote: post #5

For a slightly more balanced perspective, try this paper: https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S016635422... : Highlights from that paper (all of which look quite reasonable to me, as a non-expert): • In vitro data suggest that chloroquine inhibits SARS Cov-2 replication. • In past research, chloroquine has shown in vitro activity against many different viruses, but no benefit in animal models. • Chloroq…

Thank you for this reasonable view. Those last few days, I have seen a great many people here piling on chloroquine and aggressively promoting it to others. Those people were sometimes alledged scientists. This is worrying. Some countries have it in their emergency guidelines, yes. But is it beyond reasonable doubt that quinine derivatives are useful in humans? No. Absolutely not.

People are incredibly prompt to jump in on unproven suggestions during a crisis, while at the same time shitting on standard evidence-based medical care all year long. Go figure...

A small-sized chinese study with unreleased data? Color me skeptical.

Re: Chloroquine phosphate has shown apparent efficacy in treating Covid-19

#47

Post by ethbro »

jshevek wrote: post #32
lultimouomo wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm reasonably sure having hospitals run out of it because it was hoarded by preppers is not a desirable outcome.

Limiting the quantity that can be purchased to a particular address or credit card or similar restriction can help with this problem. As can inflating the price (high taxes) for non-doctors who are purchasing preemptively. If you are sick, go to a doctor and get it at the normal price. If you are a prepper, pay extra, buy less.

That still causes shortages. It's just increasing the ultimate gray market resale price.

Looking at potential death puts gray market buyers in a weak negotiating position.

Re: Chloroquine phosphate has shown apparent efficacy in treating Covid-19

#48

Post by khafra »

_-___________-_ wrote: post #42
ustamills wrote: post #39

Isn't that the "tonic" in "Gin & Tonic" ?

It's an analogue of quinine, which tonic water nowadays may contain varying (quite small) amounts of, depending on brand etc. G&Ts almost certainly won't have any effect on your susceptibility to infection nor your prognosis once infected. But they might help with (or make worse?) the anxiety associated with the panic.

Tonic water can contain up to 83mg/L actual quinine. Three 2L bottles of tonic water could get you 500mg, a therapeutic dose of quinine. Unfortunately, I have not found any place that manufacturers note how much quinine is in their tonic water.

Re: Chloroquine phosphate has shown apparent efficacy in treating Covid-19

#49

Post by _-___________-_ »

khafra wrote: post #48
_-___________-_ wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's an analogue of quinine, which tonic water nowadays may contain varying (quite small) amounts of, depending on brand etc. G&Ts almost certainly won't have any effect on your susceptibility to infection nor your prognosis once infected. But they might help with (or make worse?) the anxiety associated with the panic.

Tonic water can contain up to 83mg/L actual quinine. Three 2L bottles of tonic water could get you 500mg, a therapeutic dose of quinine. Unfortunately, I have not found any place that manufacturers note how much quinine is in their tonic water.

Yeah, I remember reading something similar years ago. But I suspect with the proliferation of "craft tonic water" there may be some "flavours" that don't contain quinine at all.

And 6L of tonic water is... quite a lot.

Re: Chloroquine phosphate has shown apparent efficacy in treating Covid-19

#50

Post by dakom »

baybal2 wrote: post #18

> • The outcomes of some current clinical trials of chloroquine in China have been announced, without access to the data. Shameless tangent, China has just booted its most competent respiratory disease epidemiologist from heading epidemic control committee for not backing Xi Jinping's "herbal remedies" https://www.taiwannews.com.tw/en/news/3895540

why does a search lead me to an article with the exact opposite story? http://www.china.org.cn/china/2020-02/19/content_75720773.ht...
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