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Italy is extending its coronavirus quarantine measures to the entire country

bbc.com

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Re: Italy is extending its coronavirus quarantine measures to the entire country

#281

Post by esistgut »

moultano wrote: post #271

This is an account from one of the doctors in Italy. https://twitter.com/jasonvanschoor/status/123714289107769753... Read the whole thing, but this passage in particular is just chilling. "5/ Patients above 65 or younger with comorbidities are not even assessed by ITU, I am not saying not tubed, I’m saying not assessed and no ITU staff attends when they arrest. Staff are working as much as they can but they are start…

Please note that Lombardy has a very very good health service. The OECD put a score on this [1]: 9.9/10. This is in the top 5% across all regions. Other european regions seem to have lower average scores and their governments are not taking serious actions. [2] How the US is reacting from my perspective (italian confined near Rome) seems borderline madness. Something about this situation confuses me a lot.

[1] https://oecdregionalwellbeing.org/ITC4.html

[2] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s85xG9Ol3Po

Re: Italy is extending its coronavirus quarantine measures to the entire country

#282

Post by cellular »

atleta wrote: post #212
Curzel wrote: post #184

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, depends on the number of cases and the effected area. If Milan is affected in Italy, you are guaranteed the virus will spread anywhere, it's a key place after all. There is also a psychological factor to count in of course... Social and ALL other media have been flooded with the virus 24/7 since the first confirmed case. It generates good views, everyone wants a piece of that, and now we have this nation-wide p…

I wouldn't call it a psychosis, because in this case people are right. If you look at the numbers [1] it went 10x in 10 days in Italy. Despite the counter measures. Now it's only 7.3k if the efficiency of the counter measures don't increase, it will be 73k in 10 days, 730k in 20 and probably 7M in a month. With 20% requiring hospitalization. Which simply cannot be managed at this scale. (Probably not even at the 730k…

I don't feel it was transmitted 10x in ten days. Those people were already infected. Otherwise, you'd have to wait a couple weeks for them to become symptomatic to know to test them. (Unless they are testing everybody, and the 10x included people that weren't symptomatic).

Re: Italy is extending its coronavirus quarantine measures to the entire country

#283

Post by techolic »

hnaccy wrote: post #272
moultano wrote: post #271

This is an account from one of the doctors in Italy. https://twitter.com/jasonvanschoor/status/123714289107769753... Read the whole thing, but this passage in particular is just chilling. "5/ Patients above 65 or younger with comorbidities are not even assessed by ITU, I am not saying not tubed, I’m saying not assessed and no ITU staff attends when they arrest. Staff are working as much as they can but they are start…

Does that mean they're just triaging them and letting them die?

It hurts me to say this, but that's what happened in Wuhan for the first few weeks.

Re: Italy is extending its coronavirus quarantine measures to the entire country

#284

Post by giovan-ni »

srg0 wrote: post #154
giovan-ni wrote: post #75

I think the sequence of choices is what matters most. First they ‘quarantined’ Lombardia and some surrounding provinces. This looked nonsensical, or worse, as the contagion spread was nationwide already. Not two full days after, they are extending the restrictive measures to the whole of Italy. The net result is to have scared back home a lot of people working or studying in Lombardia, thereby easing the potential bu…

The new decree is probably a response to many potentially contagious people fleeing to the south. As I see it, if the draft version of the previous decree were not leaked, the final version would not cause so many people to run away. Frankly, I expected that these measures will be extended to the entire country not later than by the end of the week. We're still in the exponential growth phase.

You are right about the leakage. The final decree places no restrictions on traveling back to residence, and even admits self-certification of other reasons for traveling.

I am not sure you are right in assuming the leakage was unintended, though. If they wanted people to run, the effective way was to force a choice under the imminent and vague threat of being trapped in the ‘red zone’.

Re: Italy is extending its coronavirus quarantine measures to the entire country

#285

Post by perrywky »

jdietrich wrote: post #256
CaciaraAsAServi wrote: post #65

I was not very surprised that Italy turned out to be the (first?) major hit in Europe. Considering the strong business connections, it had to be either us or Germany. We are, as much of the world, importers from China, but many enterprises here are also, somewhat, strong exporters to China (I can see it from my dayjob as industrial automation SI), and if you factor in the small average size of Italian companies requi…

>We are, as much of the world, importers from China, but many enterprises here are also, somewhat, strong exporters to China Italy also has a surprisingly large number of Chinese migrant workers, mainly in the fashion and leather goods sector. Skilled Chinese workers in Milan and Prato provide the kudos of the "Made in Italy" label at considerably lower cost. https://www.economist.com/special-report/2018/05/17/long-t…

Many of them are from Zhejiang province of China, and since the outbreak in Italy, Zhejiang now have 7 "imported cases" from Italy.

http://www.xinhuanet.com/english/2020-03/03/c_138838575.htm

Re: Italy is extending its coronavirus quarantine measures to the entire country

#286

Post by throwaway122378 »

moultano wrote: post #271

This is an account from one of the doctors in Italy. https://twitter.com/jasonvanschoor/status/123714289107769753... Read the whole thing, but this passage in particular is just chilling. "5/ Patients above 65 or younger with comorbidities are not even assessed by ITU, I am not saying not tubed, I’m saying not assessed and no ITU staff attends when they arrest. Staff are working as much as they can but they are start…

That account has TEN tweets spanning 2013 - 2020. Then this thread. Don’t believe everything you read even if it sounds like a believable novel

Re: Italy is extending its coronavirus quarantine measures to the entire country

#287

Post by koheripbal »

throwaway122378 wrote: post #286
moultano wrote: post #271

This is an account from one of the doctors in Italy. https://twitter.com/jasonvanschoor/status/123714289107769753... Read the whole thing, but this passage in particular is just chilling. "5/ Patients above 65 or younger with comorbidities are not even assessed by ITU, I am not saying not tubed, I’m saying not assessed and no ITU staff attends when they arrest. Staff are working as much as they can but they are start…

That account has TEN tweets spanning 2013 - 2020. Then this thread. Don’t believe everything you read even if it sounds like a believable novel

Doesn't that increase the credibility? Most working professionals don't tweet much at all.

I think I have 5 tweets in the last 10 years.

Re: Italy is extending its coronavirus quarantine measures to the entire country

#288

Post by Gibbon1 »

alisonatwork wrote: post #168
afiori wrote: post #93

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The problem with this is that a 14 day total economic halt will be devastating. Even assuming all office workers work remote basic social structure will be endangered. The hospitals need to stay open, people need to keep operating water and electricity utilities, food distribution needs to continue as many do not have 14 days of stock at home. It is not about those dams politician that only care about reelection numb…

In China we have been on economic halt since late January. The hospitals stay open, utilities are running, food deliveries, all of that is still working. There is no shortage of food or other daily products. What has changed is that almost everything is being delivered from online store or purchased from supermarket or pharmacy during restricted hours. Anybody who worked a pink collar job before has no job now. Anybo…

I think how devastating it is depends on whether the government will just step in to make things whole or not. Seriously the government could just tell payroll companies to cut checks as normal and put it on the treasuries dime. They could just declare debt holidays.

Probably means people and businesses in places like China will be mostly 'fine' and people in the US are going to get savaged.

Re: Italy is extending its coronavirus quarantine measures to the entire country

#289

Post by koheripbal »

wolco wrote: post #169
paganel wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I hope (and suspect) that the ECB (and Europe as a whole) will financially stand behind Italy, no questions asked (I'm a fellow European).

What happens when France and Germany and Spain reach Italy totals? Who will be left to help out?

I believe Turkey is sending people to help...

Re: Italy is extending its coronavirus quarantine measures to the entire country

#290

Post by luckydata »

throwaway122378 wrote: post #286
moultano wrote: post #271

This is an account from one of the doctors in Italy. https://twitter.com/jasonvanschoor/status/123714289107769753... Read the whole thing, but this passage in particular is just chilling. "5/ Patients above 65 or younger with comorbidities are not even assessed by ITU, I am not saying not tubed, I’m saying not assessed and no ITU staff attends when they arrest. Staff are working as much as they can but they are start…

That account has TEN tweets spanning 2013 - 2020. Then this thread. Don’t believe everything you read even if it sounds like a believable novel

This is an idiotic comment. The thread is a literal translation of this article written by the MD telling the story:

https://www.ecodibergamo.it/stories/bergamo-citta/con-le-nos...

this is an online profile for the doctor:

https://www.dottori.it/daniele-macchini-516895

The post was originally shared on Facebook.

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