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Not being an asshole will make you more money

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Re: Not being an asshole will make you more money

#211

Post by mewse »

itwy wrote: post #205
duxup wrote: post #102

Kinda off topic but other side of the coin, befriending the asshole: At my first job there was this grizzly old engineer who was known for being pretty surly, but knew the code base almost as if by memory, and the behavior of the code. He was bothered by anything and everything and really just wanted to run out the clock and go home and work in his wood shop. I was in support and nobody wanted to go to him for help,…

Not a native speaker but shouldn't grizzly above be grizzled? :)

If you go by the dictionary, "grizzled" and "grizzly" both have the same meaning; having grey hair.

In common use, though, "grizzled" is generally used to imply "old" or even "unkempt", and "grizzly" is generally used to imply "bad-tempered" (probably alluding to the behaviour of the "grizzly bear")

..in this case, according to the story, either word would apply!

Re: Not being an asshole will make you more money

#212

Post by mustacheemperor »

ta1234567890 wrote: post #157
xwdv wrote: post #137

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why would he make it so personal? What did you guys do to him?

Great question. We are still trying to figure that out. We've consulted with multiple lawyers and therapists to try to fully understand the situation. Two guesses so far: 1) When he "offered" to take over the company, he said he would fire me and keep my cofounder running sales. This whole ordeal also coincidentally started a couple of days after my cofounder said she would be stepping down as CEO (even though he had…

Does the “ordeal” refer to the attempted takeover, or did this investor refused to extend their convertible note shortly after the CEO stepped down?

Re: Not being an asshole will make you more money

#213

Post by ta1234567890 »

graeme wrote: post #201
ta1234567890 wrote: post #125

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You are correct. He most likely would have gotten his money back, even without renewing the note, had he accepted a payment plan. Instead, he chose to start a (very costly) legal fight. So far he's probably out $100k+ in legal fees and looking to spend $100-200k more in the new personal lawsuit. The original note was for $250k. I don't think he's ever going to recover the full amount of money he's put into this (not…

This actually seems to support the article’s thesis then: doing business with an asshole hurt you, but being an asshole didn’t help the asshole. It cost him money, attention, and precious irreplaceable time.

Exactly. The asshole hurt me, my cofounder, several people who lost their jobs, several people who lost their investments and many people who lost valuable time in their lives. It's unclear if it helped him in any way, maybe that's my problem and I don't understand the game he is playing.

It seems like the only ones that have benefited (because they got paid to put their time on this), are the lawyers involved, and the people running the courts.

Re: Not being an asshole will make you more money

#214

Post by airstrike »

Ericson2314 wrote: post #194
airstrike wrote: post #159

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Being an American doesn't make it any less prejudiced. It's a gross generalization. Even assuming it were true, how is this an exclusive characteristic of America?

I don't know whether it's exclusive. I never claimed that.

Your singling out of the country implies as much.

If it's not exclusive to America, you should have said "It's standard bullshit"

Re: Not being an asshole will make you more money

#215

Post by refurb »

dumbfoundded wrote: post #154
koheripbal wrote: post #12

The major flaw in this article is that it does not defined what constitutes "asshole" behavior. There is a difference, for example, between being vindictive towards others, and simply pushing people out of their comfort zone. The term "asshole" is so vague that it borders on useless.

In the context of business, I would frame being an asshole as doing things that benefit yourself at the expense of others. Not being an asshole is doing things that benefit yourself and others. Let's say you sell some Saas tool. You're an asshole if you try to sell to anyone even if you think it won't help them. You're not an asshole if you truly believe your service will benefit your customers. You're an idiot if yo…

benefit yourself at the expense of others.

That’s way too general. If I’m a start up raising money from a VC and I counter with an offer of a lower percentage of equity for an investment, I’m doing something that benefits me at the expense of others.

I would say you’d need to layer on top being deceitful or underhanded in your actions.

The goal is that everyone enters into an arrangement with full knowledge of the terms.

Re: Not being an asshole will make you more money

#216

Post by jacobush »

solaris00 wrote: post #204
RobertRoberts wrote: post #168

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> That so feels like a mistake... Easy to test. 1. Send back the document he sent with a copy of your most recent edits and ask him to confirm if his document is correct. 2. But, make note of at ONE error, and see if he fixes all of them. 3. If he only fixes only the one, then he's either really lazy or trying to keep up the deceit. 4. Repeat steps 1 to 3, be sure to CC everyone involved. If he's lazy he will be asha…

Why the indirectness? Is there a downside to directly confronting the lawyer?

You may never know. "Oh, my mistake. Sorry, I'll have the correct draft for you this afternoon."

Re: Not being an asshole will make you more money

#217

Post by dean177 »

jeremyvisser wrote: post #208
thomk wrote: post #164

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Civil lawsuits come down to just one thing in this country: MONEY. Not the law, not what is right or who has been virtuous. Just money. Or more specifically: who has the money. If you are poor and you sue someone who is rich, they control that outcome. If you are rich and you sue someone who is poor, they (by default) control that outcome; there's nothing there. If you are both poor, a judge will often decide based w…

Considering you're commenting in an international forum, what is "this country"?

Clearly the USA. What point are you trying to make?

Re: Not being an asshole will make you more money

#218

Post by rriepe »

koheripbal wrote: post #12

The major flaw in this article is that it does not defined what constitutes "asshole" behavior. There is a difference, for example, between being vindictive towards others, and simply pushing people out of their comfort zone. The term "asshole" is so vague that it borders on useless.

I think it means "individual" most of the time.

Re: Not being an asshole will make you more money

#219

Post by wozniacki »

Jommi wrote: post #138
listsfrin wrote: post #131

Earlier quoted context omitted.

* if you have the money and the people prepared for 3)

This point only pertains in places with a poisonous legal system, such as US or UK.

Could you perhaps explain how it works in your country or other countries, in such matters? I'm not necessarily knocking any non-US or non-UK judiciaries or jurisprudence(s); in fact if anything I find US or UK systems poisonous too - as you describe it - to a high degree in some cases.

But how does a modern, complex and non-homogeneous society aribiter cases without turning "poisonous" or odious to some members?

To my knowledge much of Europe, M.E., Asia and even S. America are composed of largely homogeneous populaces with a smattering of outsiders at best.

Re: Not being an asshole will make you more money

#220

Post by bsder »

duxup wrote: post #102

Kinda off topic but other side of the coin, befriending the asshole: At my first job there was this grizzly old engineer who was known for being pretty surly, but knew the code base almost as if by memory, and the behavior of the code. He was bothered by anything and everything and really just wanted to run out the clock and go home and work in his wood shop. I was in support and nobody wanted to go to him for help,…

> At my first job there was this grizzly old engineer who was known for being pretty surly

There is a VAST difference between "surly" and "asshole".

"Surly" is the result of dealing with legions of idiots for 30+ years. Someone who demonstrates "not-an-idiot" is likely to find the "surly" person quite reasonable and trustworthy.

"Asshole" is someone who engages in behaviors to your detriment and simply CANNOT be trusted. You either need to avoid these people or actively destroy them before they get rolling.

Unfortunately, it seems that standard corporate politics is unable to distinguish between the two.

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