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Not being an asshole will make you more money

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Re: Not being an asshole will make you more money

#111

Post by seanhunter »

fma wrote: post #14
seanhunter wrote: post #5

I have an example. In a previous role was in a position where we were negotiating a large-ish (>1M USD) multi-year contract when our client asked us to also do a proof of concept about some topic. It was just 1 week or 2 weeks so I said it would be free but because of various regulatory stuff we needed a contract in place. I was dealing with the same purchasing lawyer on both contracts. The process was super-standard…

What happened after? FWIW My wife and I were negotiating a commercial lease and we always did a diff between what they send back and what we sent them in case they pulled something like that. It may not be malicious (i.e. they updated a wrong version). They had integrity and they didn't do pull any stunts.

We called him out on it, he sent a new version and we executed. On the big contract he tried several other small variants on this (going back and post-hoc altering wording that had been agreed, delaying things for no reason, just generally being an incredible pain in the ass to deal with in a million small ways) until we got a press release from the CEO of his (global) company saying how happy they were to work with us and his demeanor instantly changed and he became super-constructive and efficient.

In spite of everything everyone on this thread thinks/says, it definitely wasn't an error. I spoke to another third-party vendor (over a beer) who were going through purchasing at the same time as us and he was doing the exact same thing with them.

Re: Not being an asshole will make you more money

#112

Post by SketchySeaBeast »

Ididntdothis wrote: post #76
SketchySeaBeast wrote: post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not even that - people venerate the results of luck. For every "self-made" billionaire, there's untold legions of people who had nearly the extra same formula, but were just a little off. Sure, a lot of them worked hard and had good ideas, but so do tons of people. Somehow it's more acceptable to think these people earned their success more than a simple lottery winner, whose long hours and hard work at their ja…

I think it’s also wrong to attribute everything to luck. The truth is probably somewhere in the middle. Zuckerberg or Gates are certainly very capable people who would have done well under most circumstances. But they were also lucky to be at the right place at the right time and meeting the right people.

I would say it leans HEAVILY towards luck. Given their background and abilities, they certainly would have done well regardless, we have to remember that "done well" can be measured in the hundreds of thousands of dollars. To increase that by another 4 orders of magnitude isn't going to be simply due to being capable.

Re: Not being an asshole will make you more money

#113

Post by volkk »

swsieber wrote: post #105
ta1234567890 wrote: post #63

A few years ago I started a company, then raised money through convertible notes. By the time the notes were due (2 years), we weren't ready to raise a round yet, so all investors extended their notes. All except one. The investor that didn't want to extend the note was also the CEO of the company that was our largest client, so not only did he call his note, he also ended his company's contract, making a huge hole i…

Is it possible for you to name said investor such that people know to stay away from said investor?

i'm going to guess that giving his name out in a public forum combined with the contextual knowledge we now have will make it very obvious who OP is. and then its possible for that asshole investor to further sue him for slander or whatever else

Re: Not being an asshole will make you more money

#114

Post by eanzenberg »

chinesempire wrote: post #86
eanzenberg wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Your model breaks down. 99.9999999...% of children of congresspeople, professors and NASA workers are not billionaires.

I think you made some mistakes in your math. There are 535 Congressmen in USA, 99.99999999% of them is well... 535. If I find the son of a Congressman that made billions your model will prove wrong Warren Buffet is one.

>>99.9999999...% of children of

Re: Not being an asshole will make you more money

#115

Post by miguelmota »

jschwartzi wrote: post #29
miguelmota wrote: post #17

The term asshole is very subjective; some people will perceive being candid and telling it how it is as being mean while others love the straightforwardness. Bosses have to put emotions aside to think more logically and that comes off as unsympathetic when talking to employees or partners. Steve Jobs was known to not have been the nicest guy yet he’s praised all the time.

You're talking about being nice, not being an asshole. Assholes are people who come in and shit all over everything instead of trying to play fair. People who are not nice can be fair. Take as an analogy the difference between social class and economic class, and how people can have a social class that's different from their economic class.

Being apathetic and selfish are some attributes that both assholes and top billionaires exhibit. I'd say it’s not so black and white and people will perceive what being nice means to them differently depending on their social economic status since people of lower economic status tend to be more susceptible to emotions than a business person.

Re: Not being an asshole will make you more money

#116

Post by airstrike »

izacus wrote: post #64
azinman2 wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are you sure it wasn’t a genuine mistake?

No, I've had this happen when drawing up contracts with American lawyers way too many times for it to be mistakes. We've had lawyers try to sneak in one sided clauses after we agreed differently with business owners pretty much constantly. It always significantly deteriorated relations with that company. But I guess Americans think that's fine because "it's just business".

> But I guess Americans think that's fine because "it's just business".

That's a really prejudiced and unwarranted view of Americans. If anything it says more about your biases and prejudices than it does about one nation.

Re: Not being an asshole will make you more money

#117

Post by airstrike »

Ericson2314 wrote: post #79
izacus wrote: post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, I've had this happen when drawing up contracts with American lawyers way too many times for it to be mistakes. We've had lawyers try to sneak in one sided clauses after we agreed differently with business owners pretty much constantly. It always significantly deteriorated relations with that company. But I guess Americans think that's fine because "it's just business".

Yeah this is standard American bullshit.

That's a really prejudiced and unwarranted view of Americans. If anything it says more about your biases and prejudices than it does about one nation.

Re: Not being an asshole will make you more money

#118

Post by mirekrusin »

Loughla wrote: post #60
mediaman wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not that easy to accept only your own changes though. You can accept all changes, or reject all changes, but accepting only your own and rejecting others, at least in Word, takes specific effort.

I attribute user error and stupidity when most people attribute malicious intent. 99% of the time, I am correct. I'm betting that, if the lawyer was not acting maliciously , s/he used the wrong version of the document to accept changes.

I double read most of my emails with more than 3 bullet points.

Re: Not being an asshole will make you more money

#119

Post by mirekrusin »

seanhunter wrote: post #111
fma wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What happened after? FWIW My wife and I were negotiating a commercial lease and we always did a diff between what they send back and what we sent them in case they pulled something like that. It may not be malicious (i.e. they updated a wrong version). They had integrity and they didn't do pull any stunts.

We called him out on it, he sent a new version and we executed. On the big contract he tried several other small variants on this (going back and post-hoc altering wording that had been agreed, delaying things for no reason, just generally being an incredible pain in the ass to deal with in a million small ways) until we got a press release from the CEO of his (global) company saying how happy they were to work with…

Maybe his pay was based on how hard he screws it?

Re: Not being an asshole will make you more money

#120

Post by ta1234567890 »

swsieber wrote: post #105
ta1234567890 wrote: post #63

A few years ago I started a company, then raised money through convertible notes. By the time the notes were due (2 years), we weren't ready to raise a round yet, so all investors extended their notes. All except one. The investor that didn't want to extend the note was also the CEO of the company that was our largest client, so not only did he call his note, he also ended his company's contract, making a huge hole i…

Is it possible for you to name said investor such that people know to stay away from said investor?

As user volkk said, unfortunately it would be legally risky for me to disclose the identity of the investor. Which is pretty frustrating, because then you realize that when someone does something bad to you (legally/morally), there are very few (legal) ways to remedy it, especially if they have a lot more money than you.

I can say that he's not based in the Bay Area, so if you are raising money there it is very unlikely you will run into him.

I can also say that our best investors were RightSide Capital, based out of SF. They supported us throughout the whole ordeal with the company and even offered to buy out the other guy. They also said that, out of 600+ investments they had done at the time, they had never seen another investor act the way ours did.

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