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Swedes rebelling against a cashless society (2018)

bbc.com

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Re: Swedes rebelling against a cashless society (2018)

#61

Post by _Microft »

yellow_postit wrote: post #41
onion2k wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why, other than your privacy? Businesses that don't accept cash don't make any money when the infrastructure fails. If your revenue is dependent on your PoS device, Wi-Fi, ISP, payment provider, the payment provider's network infrastructure, banking network, and more that's a lot of risk. For most independent businesses having a working cash register and a bank account that enables cash deposits would be a better opt…

Storing carbon copies of credit cards is something still supported for when the network goes down, see “credit card imprinter”

Thanks for this bit of information, now the raised print on credit cards finally makes sense.

Re: Swedes rebelling against a cashless society (2018)

#62

Post by anovikov »

dehrmann wrote: post #17

Part of why cashless works is the same reason the Swedish welfare state generally works: a trust of government. Contrast this with Germany and its history with...lists; it's best not to have yourself be too traceable. I think the US is somewhere in-between, but at the end of the day, we'll hand over a lot for 2% cashback and avoid paying for journalism at all costs.

In Russia, people logically, and quite justified, distrust the government as much as possible. Government there has a huge history of enslaving, torturing and killing their citizens all the way through today, in way Germany didn't know since the times of Nazis, not even in the GDR. Yet, everyday transactions in Russia are pretty much cashless, people pay to one another through card-to-card transfers and mobile payment are almost as universal as in China (where people don't trust their government at all btw).

Re: Swedes rebelling against a cashless society (2018)

#64

Post by Symbiote »

lkramer wrote: post #60
dehrmann wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Being able to pay through cards and phones is super convenient I was very impressed by Sydney's train between the airport and city that can take assorted contactless payments at the turnstile. None of this figuring out how many zones I need a ticket for or buying a $20 card and only using $9.50.

The London Underground has the same thing. It will automatically calculate what you pay based on how many journeys and what zones you travel within, using either a dedicated card or contactless.

London has had that for years now (rolled out 2012-2014), but I was particularly impressed to see a similar system on the buses in Belgrade.

Re: Swedes rebelling against a cashless society (2018)

#65

Post by LatteLazy »

ce4 wrote: post #30
LatteLazy wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Of course, the German government that made lists did so without credit card records or electronic ids or anything like that...

This misses the point - the spying-on-your-citizens was decided by the state on purpose, going completely cashless enables dragnet surveillance that makes it really hard to evade if one has to (journalists, dissidents)

Oh, I was just answering the German comparison. I agree that mass surveillance is a terrible idea and is incomparable with democracy.

Re: Swedes rebelling against a cashless society (2018)

#66

Post by codr7 »

I recently moved back to Sweden after living 4 years in Germany. I don't have any cards, and I don't carry a "smart"phone anymore; in Germany this didn't cause any trouble at all and I was far from alone.

Much of the current Swedish society is currently closed to me, I know of three shops and one cafe in the (200k people) city center that accept cash. Some of it has been gradual but it changed dramatically during the time I was away.

Believe me, this is not the kind of world anyone really wants to live in. It's all very convenient until the crap hits the fan, putting this much power in the hands of any authority is a recipe for disaster. Not to mention those who have no choice.

Re: Swedes rebelling against a cashless society (2018)

#68

Post by theshrike79 »

throwaway99674 wrote: post #57
username90 wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is around $20 a year, there are no people poor enough for that to be an issue in Europe.

Believe me, there are people in Europe for who paying 20€ extra can be an issue. Even worse: unexpectedly having to pay 20€. Source: been there, done that.

It's not an unexpected 20€, more like 1-2 euros a month. Every month. At the same time.

Re: Swedes rebelling against a cashless society (2018)

#70

Post by simongray »

vnorilo wrote: post #50
Svip wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've encountered one merchant in Denmark using iZettle. He has since replaced it with the regular PoS. I can only imagine that is more expensive for him, but I wonder why he abandoned iZettle? Maybe it doesn't work that well? I am honestly wondering why I don't see more usage of iZettle. It could just be a Danish thing. And yes, there is Swish/MobilePay, but that only really works if you're local. A tourist - even on…

At least here in Finland, I associate iZettle with artisans, coffee stands, small farmers and ad hoc store fronts. Cheap and cheerful. Not that I mind it as a customer, but could be an image thing.

Same association in Denmark.
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