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UC Santa Cruz fires 54 grad students who were striking for higher pay

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Re: UC Santa Cruz fires 54 grad students who were striking for higher pay

#271

Post by tnecniv »

chrisseaton wrote: post #14
hedora wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There’s no clear path to replacing UAW. They somehow got in control of union representation for the entire UC system. The US is a closed shop country, so it is illegal for students to simply cancel their membership in UAW and join a graduate student workers union. I’m not familiar enough with labor law to know the exact proceedue, but presumably students would need to mount a state-wide campaign to vote UAW out (if i…

Wow being a graduate student is closed-shop in the US?! That’s crazy I never knew that. How does that square with academic and political freedom? A student who researches union abuse must join and fund a union!

It's worth noting that graduate students were not able to unionize until recently at many private universities in the US. Even though they now can legally unionize, many remain unionless for one reason or another.

Re: UC Santa Cruz fires 54 grad students who were striking for higher pay

#272

Post by datashow »

lovich wrote: post #215
datashow wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There must be some misunderstanding. The provost doesn't take the overhead, the university does, which is a common practice.

I didn't realize that "common" was a synonym for "good" or "desirable"

There is a reason for this common practice. Do researchers pay office spaces, internet, electricity, utilities, etc...? No. So there is overhead.

Re: UC Santa Cruz fires 54 grad students who were striking for higher pay

#273

Post by ip26 »

valid4life wrote: post #83

I'm an undergrad at UCSC right now and have found the entire strike to be more detrimental to their cause. They've lost so much undergrad support after disrupting a STEM midterm and shutting down campus causing us to miss the classes we have paid for. I even lost my grades last quarter as my TA was fired ( of the 54 ) and he has refused to hand them over post firing. What it has done to the undergraduates is a little…

There seems to be a history of strikes at UCSC alienating the rank and file.

Strikes are supposed to squeeze the employer, e.g. because their factory isn't producing and the employer is losing face & sales to competitors.

All the strikes at UCSC seem to wind up squeezing the student body, which 1) doesn't call the shots and 2) is paying fixed costs.

Last one I remember was a transit strike where the strikers closed all entrances & exits to the campus. That did not win them many supporters.

Re: UC Santa Cruz fires 54 grad students who were striking for higher pay

#274

Post by shitgoose »

unethical_ban wrote: post #238
kova12 wrote: post #233

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Which just underlies the problem with unions: not only they are compulsory institutions that force you into their ranks whether you want it or not, but even those who join them don't get a fair representation and have to strike on their own.

Define "fair representation" And, tell me how not having any union is better for all than an imperfect union.

Is there a union of software developers? Would you like to start an imperfect one? Anyone?

Re: UC Santa Cruz fires 54 grad students who were striking for higher pay

#275

Post by ausbah »

cycrutchfield wrote: post #164
gyrgtyn wrote: post #124

A bunch of people that make 500K try to explain why people that make 28K shouldn't make 45K. In a town where rent is 20K.

I survived in grad school on much less than 28k in a very high cost of living city. If anything, graduate student compensation is ridiculously high these days. I don't see anything but money-grubbing here.

so just because you had it bad, other people shouldn't have it better?

Re: UC Santa Cruz fires 54 grad students who were striking for higher pay

#276

Post by ausbah »

GhostVII wrote: post #141

Sounds like some unionized grad students decided to go on strike on their own, without the unions approval. Firing doesn't seem unreasonable to me in that case, and it certainly isn't "union busting" as Bernie Sanders said in the article, given that the school has an agreement with the union. If you never could get fired for striking, it would allow employees to hold the school hostage indefinitely while making unrea…

it's hard to say that with a straight face when the union doesn't represent their interests

Re: UC Santa Cruz fires 54 grad students who were striking for higher pay

#277

Post by geodel »

RijilV wrote: post #42
nabla9 wrote: post #3

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Simpsons grad student sketch is different kind of funny for different people. For most people it's funny because it's exaggeration, for others it's funny because it's so close to reality. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qqrCoyVK80I --- On more serious note, grad student working for next to nothing serves similar function as unpaid internships in companies and politics. Some positions are designed to help young people…

Except, in the case of big tech, Internships pay six figures . There are other perks of being a grad student than just the pay though... : sure, the internships aren’t typically a year long, but if you do the math for what’s paid for their duration it’s an incredible amount if it did last a year.

Then what's stopping unpaid interns to take big tech internship?

Re: UC Santa Cruz fires 54 grad students who were striking for higher pay

#278

Post by saagarjha »

CameronNemo wrote: post #197
inferiorhuman wrote: post #170

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Even worse the UC system (and by extension UCSC) are state run institutions that get a hefty chunk of their operating budget from the state. They also prioritize foreign students over domestic as they pay higher tuition (nee fees as it was illegal in California for UC and CSU schools to charge tuition for a very long time). The state should not be in the business of exploiting cheap labor. Period. It's fucking absurd…

There are strikes at UCSD and UCSB.

UC Davis, I believe. UC San Diego is awaiting poll results to decide whether they'd like to strike.

Re: UC Santa Cruz fires 54 grad students who were striking for higher pay

#279

Post by crummy »

epistasis wrote: post #267
refurb wrote: post #260

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Does it matter? They asked their union to represent them along with the other UCSC union members (they are a small part of the members). The union did so, and they are held to that contract.

If somebody bargains on your behalf, and you have no way to reject what they bargained for, can you really say that they acted in your behalf at all?

You just need to form a union-union (meta-union?) to bargain with your union.

Re: UC Santa Cruz fires 54 grad students who were striking for higher pay

#280

Post by ausbah »

macinjosh wrote: post #76

Just because you exist does not mean you deserve success. This strain of leftism is essentially just jealousy and entitlement. I learned life isn't fair as a child it really isn't that hard of concept to grasp. That gave me the motivation to think about what I wanted out of life and to work towards that goal. I didn't get a loan from parents (they barely made ends meet growing up). I didn't go to college or a code ca…

sounds like you had a tough or not very easy start to life, which isn't great, but saying "screw you" to anyone who wants to improve the system for everyone is just promoting something bad because you had to

and to suggest that grad students don't have "actual grit and work" is stupid, they work just as hard and long - if not more - then any other person with a "normal job". and they know well that they won't be getting paid great, so their only real motivation to be doing their work - is because they love their work all else be damned, so trying to paint them as money grabbing leeches or something when they want a livable wage is just stupid

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