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Assange Hearing Day 2

craigmurray.org.uk

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Re: Assange Hearing Day 2

#251

Post by FireBeyond »

101404 wrote: post #66
mcv wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

These are not things that "they" did, though. They're things that "he" did.

Propaganda works. You probably once supported his fight for free speech, until they made up the "Trump supporter" story. With that, they actually managed to catch many people who previously supported him. Of course, he was "left" and they told all his friends that he "now supports the enemy". Was a really clever framing move.

Made up how, exactly?

> On Oct. 3, WikiLeaks, writing a day before it was set to announce the release of hacked Democratic emails, wrote to Trump Jr.: "Hiya. It'd be great if you guys could comment on /push this story."

* https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2017/11/the-sec...

* https://www.npr.org/sections/thetwo-way/2017/11/14/563996442...

* https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/donald-trump/trump-campaign...

Which aspects of these stories were "made up"?

Re: Assange Hearing Day 2

#252

Post by glennvtx »

linuxftw wrote: post #143
spinglespingle wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

the US has successfully become a 3rd world country. power in the hands of a few: check corruption at the highest possible level: check a gradually more authoritarian "leader": check a people who support such a leader: check military might used against political opponents: check enormous amounts of poverty cleverly ignored: check the list goes on. i suppose there is a time for every powerful nation to go into a deep d…

As if any of this is recent. People keep voting for the same crooks, generation after generation. Another election cycle, nobody is talking about the wars, just what benefits the government should pay for.

Nailed it. Just vote harder, amirite? This has come so far from the individual freedom that the bill of rights was envisioned to protect. Now the question is "what is right thing to do for me" rather than "what is the right thing to do."

The American Republic will endure until the day Congress discovers that it can bribe the public with the public's money. - anon

Re: Assange Hearing Day 2

#253

Post by FireBeyond »

AnimalMuppet wrote: post #230
cmroanirgo wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Interesting. > Extradition hearings are not held at Belmarsh Magistrates Court inside Woolwich Crown Court. They are always held at Westminster Magistrates Court as the application is deemed to be delivered to the government at Westminster. Now get your head around this. This hearing is at Westminster Magistrates Court. It is being held by the Westminster magistrates and Westminster court staff, but located at Belmar…

An alternate possibility is that this one reporter is too biased to report accurately. "Everyone's hiding the truth but me" is sometimes true, but not always.

This reporter makes no bones about being a close personal friend.

He's also stated with no evidence but only conjecture and supposition that "the US government has given explicit directions to the UK magistrate in how they are to treat the case", and "found it odd" that US officials were in court (for an extradition hearing to the US?).

Re: Assange Hearing Day 2

#255

Post by FireBeyond »

EliRivers wrote: post #74
doe88 wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The Guardian (never to be accused of outlandish sympathies toward Assange) https://www.theguardian.com/media/2020/feb/25/julian-assange...

I'll be honest; I genuinely don't know how many times I would expect someone to have handcuffs attached and released in such circumstances. Is eleven times a lot? The Guardian doesn't actually express whether this is excessive or lenient. The Guardian doesn't seem to make any comment on that. I would expect his defence lawyer to complain about his conditions no matter what. The article headlines with thehandcuffs, bu…

> I'll be honest; I genuinely don't know how many times I would expect someone to have handcuffs attached and released in such circumstances. Is eleven times a lot? The Guardian doesn't actually express whether this is excessive or lenient.

1. Moved from prison cell to holding cell at prison for transport.

2. Moved from holding cell into transport.

3. Moved from transport into court holding cell.

4. Moved from court holding cell into court.

And reverse equals at least 8. Add in a pretrial meeting with lawyer, and I can see 10 times in a day at court happening, entirely.

Re: Assange Hearing Day 2

#256

Post by FireBeyond »

henearkr wrote: post #124
bilekas wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well according to the other side, people died because of the releases. Information was lost, sources fled. https://text.npr.org/s.php?sId=712659290 So again, right or wrong depends on your opinion. Also again, I re-iterate and stress. I am not defending the bad actions of the US or anyone, I just don't believe that Assange is this 'holier than though' who needs to be coveted.

You seem to imply that, because there were dramatic consequences from the release, then he was guilty from the release. Again, it seems that the problematic leak (uncensored names) comes from a 3rd party, so your implication is like a sophism.

Apparently in your world one cannot be an accessory. If you arranged, assisted with and actively participated in the exfiltration of classified information, handed it on to someone else who agreed with you when you said "states can decrypt this; best just to publish now", apparently you get to say "woah, woah, woah, why are you angry at me, I had nothing to do with people getting hold of the information in these documents!". Who is being sophist now?

Re: Assange Hearing Day 2

#257

Post by Quekid5 »

Fjolsvith wrote: post #118
jonathanstrange wrote: post #93

I think there is an important point missing in the debate. This is an extradition hearing. It doesn't matter whether Assange is guilty of the alleged crimes the US has come up with or not, what matters is whether he is expected to receive a fair trial in the US and whether the potential sentences in the US would be roughly on a par with what he'd expect for the same alleged crimes in the UK. For all I can see, this i…

> As another example, a prison in Illinois was under 23 years of permanent lockdown, meaning that all inmates were in isolation for 23 years. You do refer to USP Marion, Illinois, which was the US's Supermax prison during that time. They held the most dangerous, violent prisoners, and of course, kept them locked down for security reasons. [1] I spent a year there after they downgraded it to a medium security facility…

> I spent a year there after they downgraded it to a medium security facility.

I don't believe you.

Re: Assange Hearing Day 2

#258

Post by xtracto »

Tepix wrote: post #159
d--b wrote: post #103

Given the state of the justice system in the UK and USA, maybe the best course of action for Assange is to get extradited, then tell the public that Wikileaks helped expose Hillary's private email server, and get pardoned by Trump...

If he is extradited, he will not receive a public trial.

Wasn't the US government trying to kill him? I guess it will be easy once they have it in their soil...

Re: Assange Hearing Day 2

#259

Post by linuxftw »

glennvtx wrote: post #252
linuxftw wrote: post #143

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As if any of this is recent. People keep voting for the same crooks, generation after generation. Another election cycle, nobody is talking about the wars, just what benefits the government should pay for.

Nailed it. Just vote harder, amirite? This has come so far from the individual freedom that the bill of rights was envisioned to protect. Now the question is "what is right thing to do for me" rather than "what is the right thing to do." The American Republic will endure until the day Congress discovers that it can bribe the public with the public's money. - anon

It's crazy. I always speak out about the wars, that's the single most important issue of our day. The government is literally killing people overseas, spending literal trillions of dollars. You would think it's something we can all agree on, but people treat you like a literal crackpot.

Re: Assange Hearing Day 2

#260

Post by carterehsmith »

mzs wrote: post #244
jonathanstrange wrote: post #93

I think there is an important point missing in the debate. This is an extradition hearing. It doesn't matter whether Assange is guilty of the alleged crimes the US has come up with or not, what matters is whether he is expected to receive a fair trial in the US and whether the potential sentences in the US would be roughly on a par with what he'd expect for the same alleged crimes in the UK. For all I can see, this i…

Please don't speculate, simply to get to the point of the hearing Assange is having now The US needed to provide: >a prosecutor's affidavit describing the facts of the case, including dates, names, docket numbers and citations, and preferably executed before a judge or magistrate (particularly if extradition is sought from a civil law country) >copies of the statutes the fugitive is said to have violated, the statute…

Wait, what is this "everycrsreport.com" -- is that some kind of authority on.. things?

Should we trust it? If so, why?

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