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Single-payer healthcare would save $450B and 68k lives a year: study

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Re: Single-payer healthcare would save $450B and 68k lives a year: study

#351

Post by alok-g »

wahern wrote: post #160
mgraczyk wrote: post #7

In the study, nearly all the computed savings comes from two sources. 1. Decrease in pharmaceutical costs as a result of better bargaining power. 2. Decrease in administrative overhead, calculated by extrapolating the overhead in medicare to the entire US healthcare economy. I don't have an informed opinion on either of these estimates, but my intuition is that #1 seems reasonable while #2 seems unlikely. The justifi…

In 2017 retail prescription drug expenditures were $333 billion, accounting for just 10% of total healthcare expenditures.[1] I realize prescription drug prices are insane, the patent regime is broken, and the industry is generally messed up. But at 10%, relying on lower cost prescription drugs to save the day isn't going to help. People feel it's a bigger issue than it is (relative to the overall problem), because i…

>> Obamacare attempted and does enact a variant of almost every concrete reform imaginable. Whatever you think of Obamacare, you can't deny that it has provided mountains of empirical data about the difficulties and promises of containing costs.

Is there a summary of the findings that gets to the root causes of why healthcare is so expensive in the US? And likewise for the difficulties? It would be a useful read for me. :-)

Re: Single-payer healthcare would save $450B and 68k lives a year: study

#352

Post by bureaucrat »

grecy wrote: post #296
onemoresoop wrote: post #79

I'm paying nearly 20k (parents+child) on insurance I don't have time to use (and luckily no serious need) and once my son went to see his pediatrician and our 'private' insurance company (that i'm not going to name) sent us bill of $500, for a check-up. We disputed the charge with the insurance and they agreed to wave the payment next month. Next month comes and guess what? The same letter comes in mail. We disputed…

I live in Canada, and haven't even earned $20k of income in a few years, but I still have excellent cover. I broke my nose, was seen within 5 minutes and it was straightened (after anaesthetic). I got hit by a car on my bike, was seen in 5 minutes, no worries. Needed and x-ray for my lugs to get residency. Took 10 minutes. Free. My brother broke his leg horribly. Multiple surgeries, a month in hospital, etc. etc. The…

Don't forget 6 months waiting time for breast cancer diagnoses.

Don't forget over a months waiting time for a simple antibiotic shot, which my friend died while waiting.

Don't forget, can't see a doctor for two freaking weeks for a simple stomatitis.

Don't forget 3+ months and waiting for a freaking endoscope procedure.

For everyone not in critical situation, your country's health care is shit. Don't even deny that it's fucked up.

Thanks god I moved out of that country after my friend died due to sepsis because of the fucked up system that made him wait months to get his antibiotic shot.

Re: Single-payer healthcare would save $450B and 68k lives a year: study

#353

Post by leetcrew »

jrs235 wrote: post #331
abruzzi wrote: post #305

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My favorite story to tell (favorite in a horrible way) about these kind of issues is this: After an accident ~15 years ago, I had an open wound that wouldn't close because it was infected with MRSA which had lodged itself in the hardware that was screwed to my tibia. I was wearing a wound vac--a device that was attached to the open wound and maintained a constant suction to pull out any bad stuff. It was there to kee…

And the really crazy and stupid thing is why are we burdening our doctors with knowing whether someone's insurance plan covers their services? Doctors ought to focus their time and talent on treating people and illnesses, not trying to calculate bills for patients.

on its face, I don't think this is as crazy as you make it seem. it's just that the complexities of medical billing has become too much for the doctor to understand and convey to the patient.

can you think of any other role where a professional interfacing directly with customers wouldn't be expected to at least estimate how much the service will cost them?

Re: Single-payer healthcare would save $450B and 68k lives a year: study

#354

Post by grecy »

bureaucrat wrote: post #352
grecy wrote: post #296

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I live in Canada, and haven't even earned $20k of income in a few years, but I still have excellent cover. I broke my nose, was seen within 5 minutes and it was straightened (after anaesthetic). I got hit by a car on my bike, was seen in 5 minutes, no worries. Needed and x-ray for my lugs to get residency. Took 10 minutes. Free. My brother broke his leg horribly. Multiple surgeries, a month in hospital, etc. etc. The…

Don't forget 6 months waiting time for breast cancer diagnoses. Don't forget over a months waiting time for a simple antibiotic shot, which my friend died while waiting. Don't forget, can't see a doctor for two freaking weeks for a simple stomatitis. Don't forget 3+ months and waiting for a freaking endoscope procedure. For everyone not in critical situation, your country's health care is shit. Don't even deny that i…

It depends entirely on where you live. Out West there is no waiting and I've never experienced any of what you're talking about.

I've only heard stories about how it is in the East, I've never met anyone first hand that has experienced it, or really hates it.

Re: Single-payer healthcare would save $450B and 68k lives a year: study

#355

Post by [deleted] »

mrep wrote: post #336
codegeek wrote: post #301

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You are missing the point. It is not about being healthy. You are always worried about the "what if I have to go see a doctor" situation in America because you don't know what it will cost and you definitely don't know what kind of issues you will have to fight through with incorrect claims, incorrect bills and what not. If someone can address that here in US, I am willing to keep the current system as is.

My max out of pocket spending is $2,600 a year and I can put $3,500 pretax money into my HSA every year which I do. What I am supposed to worried about?

[deleted]

Re: Single-payer healthcare would save $450B and 68k lives a year: study

#356

Post by D-Coder »

BurningFrog wrote: post #277
onemoresoop wrote: post #79

I'm paying nearly 20k (parents+child) on insurance I don't have time to use (and luckily no serious need) and once my son went to see his pediatrician and our 'private' insurance company (that i'm not going to name) sent us bill of $500, for a check-up. We disputed the charge with the insurance and they agreed to wave the payment next month. Next month comes and guess what? The same letter comes in mail. We disputed…

The trap to be aware of here is that the fact that the current system sucks is no guarantee that any proposed alternative will be better.

Unless the alternative includes forks to the eyeball, it could hardly be worse.

Re: Single-payer healthcare would save $450B and 68k lives a year: study

#357

Post by kasey_junk »

Gibbon1 wrote: post #256
markroseman wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Lower administrative costs? In the US, doctors need at least one or two full-time admin staff to negotiate with a variety of insurance providers, argue for approval of every line item, etc. Here in Canada, I spend about 5-10 minutes per week dealing with all aspects of billing for my wife's medical practice.

Back when I was a teenager my doctor was part of a four doctor practice. They had a nurse and one of the doctors wives handled everything else. Compare with a doctors office today.

My doctor does not have any full time staff. He does not accept health insurance directly though is in many networks so you can submit claims for reimbursement.

I tend not to because he’s so cheap it’s not worth the hassle.

Re: Single-payer healthcare would save $450B and 68k lives a year: study

#358

Post by twodave »

The biggest problem I have with health insurance is that it’s nearly impossible for either the insurance or a provider to tell me how much something other than a routine visit will cost me until after services have already been rendered. Forget the high costs, I can’t even make an informed decision half the time unless I just go by the uninsured rates.

Re: Single-payer healthcare would save $450B and 68k lives a year: study

#359

Post by bureaucrat »

grecy wrote: post #354
bureaucrat wrote: post #352

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Don't forget 6 months waiting time for breast cancer diagnoses. Don't forget over a months waiting time for a simple antibiotic shot, which my friend died while waiting. Don't forget, can't see a doctor for two freaking weeks for a simple stomatitis. Don't forget 3+ months and waiting for a freaking endoscope procedure. For everyone not in critical situation, your country's health care is shit. Don't even deny that i…

It depends entirely on where you live. Out West there is no waiting and I've never experienced any of what you're talking about. I've only heard stories about how it is in the East, I've never met anyone first hand that has experienced it, or really hates it.

Because you haven't experienced a problem in your body that is rotten deep inside but shows little to no symptoms. My friend died in Alberta. It took two weeks to even see a doctor and more to wait for antibiotic shots.

Doctors try hard to not make problem a problem because the system is fucked in a way that doctors benefit from less patients. They don't try to cure. They wrap up the symptom and makes patients think it's a small problem.

Oh yeah, there is a way to be cured without waiting in Canada. When you're on the verge of death.

I despise hypocrites praising health-not-care in Canada. It just makes me sick.

Re: Single-payer healthcare would save $450B and 68k lives a year: study

#360

Post by RickJWagner »

elihu wrote: post #238
beat wrote: post #149

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is where I think political leaders (Democrat or Republican) could do really well. It's not just making sure people are covered. It's the existential dread of dealing with opaque, unpredictable, and incomprehensible bureaucracy that can make life-and-death decisions or drop financially crippling bills in your lap, even if you have good insurance . The American health care system isn't just bad for the poor. It's…

It's the same thing with taxes: we can debate about what the right level of taxes should be for this person or that, but all the effort and money spent filling out tax returns is pure waste.

Yes, and the tax labyrinth is kept artificially complicated due to lobbying, too!
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