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DigitalOcean raises $100M in debt as it scales toward revenue of $300M

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Re: DigitalOcean raises $100M in debt as it scales toward revenue of $300M

#271

Post by jdance »

gexla wrote: post #231

Echoing a lot of other comments here. I don't get why DigitalOcean exists. I would never use them over AWS, GCP, or Azure. They can't beat anyone on cost or functionality. I'm not convinced on simplicity. The other platforms aren't that difficult to use and for some you have to deal with regardless. For example, if you want to use Google Maps, then you need to use GCP to get access to the API. Since you're already in…

I'm a DO customer. I tried to figure out what running a windows server would cost on Azure once (since DO doesn't provide windows). I didn't manage to figure it out after like 20 minutes, and the complexity was just mind blowing. I literally got a bit of a shock, and felt pretty stupid that I couldn't figure out such a simple thing. The thought going through my head was something like "does people actually use this?". So that's a radically different perspective for you :)

Re: DigitalOcean raises $100M in debt as it scales toward revenue of $300M

#272

Post by gexla »

btzll wrote: post #260
gexla wrote: post #231

Echoing a lot of other comments here. I don't get why DigitalOcean exists. I would never use them over AWS, GCP, or Azure. They can't beat anyone on cost or functionality. I'm not convinced on simplicity. The other platforms aren't that difficult to use and for some you have to deal with regardless. For example, if you want to use Google Maps, then you need to use GCP to get access to the API. Since you're already in…

"I don't get why Ubuntu exists, I would never use it over Mac or Windows" Having options is good, and there are many reasons someone would prefer them over AWS, GCP or Azure.

They just raised $100M and they aren't yet profitable. The markets will judge. And that judgement is still out until they become profitable.

Re: DigitalOcean raises $100M in debt as it scales toward revenue of $300M

#273

Post by gexla »

jdance wrote: post #271
gexla wrote: post #231

Echoing a lot of other comments here. I don't get why DigitalOcean exists. I would never use them over AWS, GCP, or Azure. They can't beat anyone on cost or functionality. I'm not convinced on simplicity. The other platforms aren't that difficult to use and for some you have to deal with regardless. For example, if you want to use Google Maps, then you need to use GCP to get access to the API. Since you're already in…

I'm a DO customer. I tried to figure out what running a windows server would cost on Azure once (since DO doesn't provide windows). I didn't manage to figure it out after like 20 minutes, and the complexity was just mind blowing. I literally got a bit of a shock, and felt pretty stupid that I couldn't figure out such a simple thing. The thought going through my head was something like "does people actually use this?"…

I haven't used Azure much. But because it's Microsoft, it's going to be a default option for a lot of customers who are entrenched in the MS world.

AWS is complex also, but I remember when you're only option to launch an EC2 instance was through the command line. And it's still easier to figure out than most of my tech stack. Not that I need to be adding anything with needless complexity.

I do actually like DigitalOcean, but in an AWS / GCP / Azure world I feel it's best to learn one of those well.

Re: DigitalOcean raises $100M in debt as it scales toward revenue of $300M

#274

Post by scarface74 »

flak48 wrote: post #269
scarface74 wrote: post #170

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not counting depreciation as part of your loss in a business is about like all of the Uber drivers who don’t take into account the wear and tear on their cars when calculating how much money they are making. Depreciation is a real expense. If you depreciate an asset down from $1000 to $0 in 3 years, you’re accounting for the fact that in three years you are going to have to replace it. There is a reason we have GAAP,…

I know about WeWorks deceptive accounting/reporting practices, but not sure what similar thing Uber has done when it comes to accounting?

https://investor.uber.com/news-events/news/press-release-det...

We define Adjusted EBITDA as net income (loss), excluding (i) income (loss) from discontinued operations, net of income taxes, (ii) net income (loss) attributable to non-controlling interests, net of tax (iii) provision for (benefit from) income taxes, (iv) income (loss) from equity method investment, net of tax, (v) interest expense, (vi) other income (expense), net, (vii) depreciation and amortization, (viii) stock-based compensation expense, (ix) certain legal, tax, and regulatory reserve changes and settlements, (x) asset impairment/loss on sale of assets, (xi) acquisition and financing related expenses, (xii) restructuring charges and (xiii) other items not indicative of our ongoing operating performance.

Re: DigitalOcean raises $100M in debt as it scales toward revenue of $300M

#275

Post by Kkoala »

mattste wrote: post #179
dkersten wrote: post #154

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What I really wish for is a simple way of running docker containers (like AWS Fargate, or at least ECS), because I want to run docker containers across multiple droplets, but I don't want the full complexity of Kubernetes. Also something akin to auto-scaling groups. If DO had those, I'd use it a whole lot more than I do (currently I only spend use approx. $140/month on DO).

I just led a migration for my small team from Zeit Now to Render ( https://render.com/ ). It has filled this need pretty well. There are some features that I wish existed but overall the simplicity has been great for our use case. They do not have auto-scaling but it's planned ( https://feedback.render.com/features/p/autoscaling ).

How is Render different from Heroku? It seems like a slightly more expensive than Heroku with slightly fewer features?

Re: DigitalOcean raises $100M in debt as it scales toward revenue of $300M

#276

Post by SahAssar »

dannyw wrote: post #223
dcchambers wrote: post #156

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For static site hosting there are a ton of "good enough" free options these days like GitHub Pages, Netlify, etc. For pure VPS, there are cheaper options, especially if you don't need a ton of customer support like DO offers. For example, buyvm.net has a VPS with 1 vCPU, 1GB RAM, 20GB SSD, and unmetered bandwidth for $3.50/mo. DO's cheapest VPS is 1 vCPU, 1GB RAM, 25GB SSD, and 1TB bandwidth for $5.00/mo. Digital Oce…

Very happy BuyVM customer. The unmetered bandwidth really is unmetered, and support from the founder has been remarkably transparent and often minutes when he's awake and working.

Have you checked the performance of their VPS:es? Any numbers to share? I've been thinking of using them because of their anycast support.

Re: DigitalOcean raises $100M in debt as it scales toward revenue of $300M

#277

Post by anurag »

Kkoala wrote: post #275
mattste wrote: post #179

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I just led a migration for my small team from Zeit Now to Render ( https://render.com/ ). It has filled this need pretty well. There are some features that I wish existed but overall the simplicity has been great for our use case. They do not have auto-scaling but it's planned ( https://feedback.render.com/features/p/autoscaling ).

How is Render different from Heroku? It seems like a slightly more expensive than Heroku with slightly fewer features?

Render is more flexible than Heroku: you can host apps that rely on disks (like Elasticsearch and MySQL), private services, cron jobs, and of course free static sites. You also get automatic zero downtime deploys, health checks and small but handy features like HTTP/2 and automatic HTTP->HTTPS redirects.

It's considerably less expensive as your application scales: a webapp that needs 3GB RAM costs $50/month on Render; on Heroku you'll pay $250/month for 2.5GB RAM, and $500/month for the next tier (14GB RAM).

And you get free chat support.

Re: DigitalOcean raises $100M in debt as it scales toward revenue of $300M

#278

Post by WrtCdEvrydy »

serverQuestion wrote: post #251
hnzix wrote: post #162

Earlier quoted context omitted.

AWS is infrastructure as a service (IaaS). You need to worry about load balancers, backup scripts, firewalls etc. Ie you need a plausible sysadmin to run it. Even Elastic Beanstalk requires some sysadmin. Heroku is platform as a service (PaaS). It abstracts away the complexity of AWS. The base cost is more expensive than raw AWS but you don't need to source and pay for a sysadmin. AWS, Heroku and DO aren't "better" t…

I have been dreaming of running my own heroku like interface on a DO droplet. Just for small sites, side projects and such. With heroku you need to pay to keep things running, though sadly with DO you need to do a lot of sysadmin work to keep things running.

What... no. Install Caprover or Flynn or any of a dozen systems that provide Heroku-like functionality.

Re: DigitalOcean raises $100M in debt as it scales toward revenue of $300M

#279

Post by WrtCdEvrydy »

jdance wrote: post #270
serverQuestion wrote: post #251

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have been dreaming of running my own heroku like interface on a DO droplet. Just for small sites, side projects and such. With heroku you need to pay to keep things running, though sadly with DO you need to do a lot of sysadmin work to keep things running.

After failing with Heroku we migrated to using Dokku on DO. And yes it is more work to do it ourselves, I didn't want to do that but here we are :) It was not a lot of work, dokku is really nice, but it was/is some work. I was hoping for almost no sysadmin work but that didn't happen.

Caprover's probably the closest I've experienced, but there was still a bit to do.

Re: DigitalOcean raises $100M in debt as it scales toward revenue of $300M

#280

Post by lowdose »

cdolan wrote: post #15

This article had more detail and substance than I usually find on TechCrunch or startup coverage in general. I do want to point out two things that bothered me in the article: 1. Using the word “raise” when talking about financing via debt seems inappropriate and very start-upy. This is a low cost of capital line of credit, is it not (due to their infrastructure and broad customer base)? 2. Why in the world are state…

Debt is a way to leverage in finance that leads to more return on equity. It is very healthy to pursue debt at this level and will have a positive effect on free cash flow especially with negative interest rates.
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