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Kickstarter employees vote to unionize

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Re: Kickstarter employees vote to unionize

#981

Post by zaccus »

wyager wrote: post #839
kerkeslager wrote: post #646

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Also, frankly, fsk free snacks. Pay me the money you were going to spend on snacks, and I'll choose whether to spend it on snacks or not. And since the money spent on free snacks was probably about $20/week, it won't be a significant consideration in any of my decisions. Bus service might be more significant in some places, but every place I've ever lived had that subsidized by the government, and long commutes are a…

Office perks are tax efficient. They aren’t subject to payroll taxes and are a deductible business expense. Not having any perks at all would be wasteful.

That's great for investors, but the benefit to employees is minimal. No, free snacks don't count as a benefit lol.

Re: Kickstarter employees vote to unionize

#982

Post by Aunche »

GaryNumanVevo wrote: post #977
Aunche wrote: post #768

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Those may be the stated reasons for a union, but for some reason, in tech, workers just want a union because they want to inject their political views into their company: > But in 2018, a heated disagreement broke out between employees and management about whether to leave a project called “Always Punch Nazis” on the platform, according to reporting in Slate. When Breitbart said the project violated Kickstarter’s ter…

And? the workers are the ones producing the platform, not the CEO or board members. It's well within their purview to inject politics if they communally agree upon it.

My point it has nothing to do with traditional motivations for unionizing that everyone is discussing. Also, workers definitely have nothing to do with deciding whether whether some content is appropriate. It has nothing to do with workplace conditions or collective bargaining. They aren't the ones who lose money when Republicans drop Kickstarter.

Re: Kickstarter employees vote to unionize

#983

Post by bluGill »

Ididntdothis wrote: post #802
bluGill wrote: post #452

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are you exactly equal to the worker next to you? If so collective bargaining makes sense because a good deal for everybody is the best deal you can get. If not, then collective bargaining is keeping some great people down. The fact that you said rockstar developer says you believe that there are some non-rockstar developers who are presumably worth less. Note that athletic unions do not bargain for wages in general (…

“Are you exactly equal to the worker next to you?” From the point of view of management one or two levels up from you, you are viewed as exactly the same. Most companies have narrow salary ranges for each level and you get more money mainly by being promoted. In a union shop this is no different.

Management gives different people different raises. They do regular reviews to decide how much those raises will be, and not every person gets the same raise. Therefore management two levels above me does in fact believe there are differences. They show up over the years both in how fast you move to the top of your level, and in how fast you move up to the next level.

In a factory union shop you get a raise based on years of service, and promotions are tied to new skills. (If you currently put tires on and become a certified welder you will get a raise even though you don't weld anything). Again, not all unions force pay scales like this, but unions that don't lose one of their reasons for existing.

Re: Kickstarter employees vote to unionize

#984

Post by cameronbrown »

gacklesmom wrote: post #481
cameronbrown wrote: post #421

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I view unions as something that's only essential in the worst case scenario. If you truly need one then I fully support that, but they come with a huge cost to innovation. It's important to not forget the trade off.

Hate to break it to you, but "unions are ok but only under specific circumstances I describe" is anti-union.

They're always 'OK' (I'm not saying they're immoral) but they do come with a cost (to innovation, to efficiency) that should not be ignored.

Re: Kickstarter employees vote to unionize

#985

Post by chillacy »

sjg007 wrote: post #936
chillacy wrote: post #905

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Many of us make more money writing software today than we could working one of those unionized jobs while having less credentialing (or not being in the top 1% like the sports players). Nothing on that list looks enviable to me.

You should actually look into those union careees and see how much they make. You’d be surprised.

There's no question that limiting the supply of labor in a job market increases its price. I just don't think it's worth the price. For unions there's an extra layer of overhead and union dues. For professional societies (like the AMA) there's an extra layer of credentialing and suspiciously low innovation.

But that's my assessment and I'm probably abnormal in my situation. I'm happy to be wrong though. If more companies form unions and these companies pay better, reward good performance more fairly, have less intrinsic bias, etc, then I'll be the first to jump ship.

Re: Kickstarter employees vote to unionize

#986

Post by fogetti »

kirstenbirgit wrote: post #15

What's the benefit of being in a union for highly specialized tech workers that are very in demand?

It didn't happen in the US but back during the 2009 global financial crisis Nokia let about 15000 employees go. Many of those were employed in Germany (I am not one of those though) and I heard they were pretty well protected by their union and up for a generous allowance when their time came to leave the company. If it were not for the union, the company would have let them go empty handed.

Re: Kickstarter employees vote to unionize

#988

Post by GaryNumanVevo »

Aunche wrote: post #982
GaryNumanVevo wrote: post #977

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And? the workers are the ones producing the platform, not the CEO or board members. It's well within their purview to inject politics if they communally agree upon it.

My point it has nothing to do with traditional motivations for unionizing that everyone is discussing. Also, workers definitely have nothing to do with deciding whether whether some content is appropriate. It has nothing to do with workplace conditions or collective bargaining. They aren't the ones who lose money when Republicans drop Kickstarter.

I ask again, and? Unionization is collective action by a group of workers. It will provide them the ability to negotiate future issues (i.e. not wanting to host Nazi kickstarters). Of course they have everything to lose if kickstarter loses money, the first people laid off aren't CEOs.

No workers = No Kickstarter. That's it.

Re: Kickstarter employees vote to unionize

#989

Post by Aunche »

GaryNumanVevo wrote: post #988
Aunche wrote: post #982

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My point it has nothing to do with traditional motivations for unionizing that everyone is discussing. Also, workers definitely have nothing to do with deciding whether whether some content is appropriate. It has nothing to do with workplace conditions or collective bargaining. They aren't the ones who lose money when Republicans drop Kickstarter.

I ask again, and? Unionization is collective action by a group of workers. It will provide them the ability to negotiate future issues (i.e. not wanting to host Nazi kickstarters). Of course they have everything to lose if kickstarter loses money, the first people laid off aren't CEOs. No workers = No Kickstarter. That's it.

No they don't lose anything. Kickstarter can't claw back their wages. Unlike, a factory worker, they can easily find another job.

They get paid a salary to do a job, not to protest business decisions. If they want to protest something, they can, but they shouldn't expect any protection from being fired because they're literally refusing to do the job they were paid to do. Do you think a book store employees should receive protection for moving all the books on evolution to the fiction section?

Re: Kickstarter employees vote to unionize

#990

Post by qzx_pierri »

dang wrote: post #392
qzx_pierri wrote: post #144

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You sound spoiled, but go off

Personal attacks will get you banned here. If you'd please review https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html and take the spirit of this site more to heart, we'd be grateful.

sorry, I wasn't thinking. I won't do it again.
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