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Apple store workers should be paid for time waiting to be searched, court rules

latimes.com

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Re: Apple store workers should be paid for time waiting to be searched, court rules

#131

Post by megablast »

8ytecoder wrote: post #81

As a thought experiment, what if companies are made to pay for commute time? How would that change the labour market? Would they hire local? Provide better transportation? Work with cities to reduce congestion? Encourage more remote work? Decide it's too expensive to hire workers and cut hours? Work towards more inclusive housing?

That is way unfair to the company, when you will have certain people who are 'happy' to travel 1.5 hours each way. This seems insane to me, but there are plenty of people who do this and see no issue at all.

How would a company hire local anyway, by rejecting candidates who live to far away? What if they promise to move, but don't end up doing it?

> Work with cities to reduce congestion?

The only real working way to do that is to ask them to introduce a congestion charge, which I am all for.

Re: Apple store workers should be paid for time waiting to be searched, court rules

#132

Post by birdyrooster »

FriendlyNormie wrote: post #53
jrockway wrote: post #15

> Employees are supposed to find a manager or security officer to do the searches after they clock out. Employees estimate that waiting for and undergoing the searches can take five to 20 minutes, or, on busiest days, up to 45 minutes. This also seems to be their process for picking up orders at the store. It's pure chaos, and I find it at least somewhat amusing that at least Apple treats their employees and customer…

Does Apple really have a “process” for picking items up? I ordered a maxed out iMac Pro for around $15,000 and waited nearly a month for it to finally arrive at the store. I got a voice mail and an email instructing me to come pick it up. Only upon driving all the way to the store was I finally informed in person that they “accidentally” gave my iMac Pro to the wrong customer an hour ago who had merely ordered a base…

Tim already has you covered, it's called shipping with required signature. They can deliver to your home or work.

Re: Apple store workers should be paid for time waiting to be searched, court rules

#133

Post by johngalt »

If being searched is a task required by your employer, I don't see how that's any different than time spent doing any other task.

This also seems like a good way to align incentives. If time spent on security is compensated time, then there is a baked-in need to make the process less onerous.

Re: Apple store workers should be paid for time waiting to be searched, court rules

#134

Post by debt »

ivalm wrote: post #90
8ytecoder wrote: post #81

As a thought experiment, what if companies are made to pay for commute time? How would that change the labour market? Would they hire local? Provide better transportation? Work with cities to reduce congestion? Encourage more remote work? Decide it's too expensive to hire workers and cut hours? Work towards more inclusive housing?

What happens if someone moves while at the job ? What happens if there is a traffic jam? What happens if the worker typically doesn't drive home directly after work (or doesn't come to work from home)? Etc....

The executive team can trim a few million off their annual bonuses so the very low number of workers that commute far distances can be compensated for that time sitting in the car.

Alas they can but they won’t and they’ll fight you in court so they don’t have to.

Re: Apple store workers should be paid for time waiting to be searched, court rules

#135

Post by hypersoar »

vageli wrote: post #52

Isn't this at odds with the ruling in Amazon's favor about a similar issue? https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/courts_law/supreme-c...

That case was under federal law. This one is under California law. The older case was decided on statutory, not Constitutional, grounds, and there was nothing in it precluding states from passing stronger laws.

Re: Apple store workers should be paid for time waiting to be searched, court rules

#136

Post by megablast »

londons_explore wrote: post #99
ivalm wrote: post #90

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What happens if someone moves while at the job ? What happens if there is a traffic jam? What happens if the worker typically doesn't drive home directly after work (or doesn't come to work from home)? Etc....

Sign into work laptop. Then start driving to work. If there's a traffic jam, that's the employers problem. For 'going somewhere else after work', it wouldn't be officially allowed - you are still working till you arrive home. Obviously some workplaces could perhaps allow flexibility as a benefit.

Wow, your suggestions are insane.

Re: Apple store workers should be paid for time waiting to be searched, court rules

#137

Post by moondev »

danso wrote: post #71
topkai22 wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I was asked to wait 45 minutes to pick up a bought and paid for phone. I left and came back later and found a more reasonable sales person, but still ended up waiting about 10 minutes. Then there was the time I made a service appointment, showed up slightly before my appointment, and waited 35 minutes for a “genius” to look at my phone. I don’t know if it’s just my local store, but I avoid Apple stores as much as I c…

Yeah that's messed up. Handing off already-paid for equipment should be smooth and a priority for them. Trying to think back when I picked up laptops, and it was always quick. But I had the freedom to go in during slow hours.

Microcenter got this right. They have a dedicated section and register for internet pickups. It's fantastic!

Re: Apple store workers should be paid for time waiting to be searched, court rules

#139

Post by addicted »

captain_qwark wrote: post #118
na85 wrote: post #114

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ugh, what an icky position to take. You're essentially arguing that workers should submit to whatever corporate dystopia the owner class can cook up, or else they'll simply find their jobs outsourced to countries where people don't have the luxury of organizing for collective action to improve labour conditions because they're too busy scraping to put food on the table.

Explain to me how waiting 20 minutes after punching out is a dystopia.

Clearly the parent is not saying Apple’s situation is a dystopia, but is saying that the underlying logic, that workers demanding anything their employers don’t want to do will lead to loss of jobs and therefore is not a good thing.

The logic the GP used implies that as long as US employees are paid more than the least paid employee in the world (which would probably be 0 considering the current existing situations of slavery in the world) they shouldn’t resist and should just accept what they are getting.

Re: Apple store workers should be paid for time waiting to be searched, court rules

#140

Post by captain_qwark »

root_axis wrote: post #130
captain_qwark wrote: post #118

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Explain to me how waiting 20 minutes after punching out is a dystopia.

You could use the same rhetorical tactic in reverse e.g. "explain how paying employees for an additional 20 minutes of their time justifies outsourcing their jobs". You'd respond "well that's only one example..."

You're not making any sense dude. My reply points out that it's ridiculous to imply that waiting unpaid for your employer to search you before leaving is anything near a dystopia.
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