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Why are you people defending Apple?

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Re: Why are you people defending Apple?

#51

Post by davidu »

burgerbrain wrote: post #43
davidu wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Comments all removed.

I don't know you, and haven't conversed with you, so I can't speak for how you support Apple. I simply oppose people who will defend any action, no matter how absurd, because they support the people behind that action in most other cases. You'll see all sorts of gymnastics used to justify it, but it really boils down to people supporting things they wouldn't normally, were they outside of context of their 'affiliatio…

I don't think I was hiding the fact that a big part of my Apple support comes equally from my distrust of Google than my love of Apple.

I just look at the wreckage each has created and would pick Apple's wreckage over Google's any day.

I'm a bit surprised that people find my position to be unusual. I think it represents reasonable behavior. But I often feel this way on HN. :-/

Re: Why are you people defending Apple?

#52

Post by Bossman »

cletus wrote: post #35
Bossman wrote: post #2

And people wonder why I hate the walled approach Apple takes. The article makes another great point about people not being able to leave iOS devices for a competitor because all their music, movies, apps, etc are in Apple's DRM format and won't transfer to other devices. Apple deserves to have control over their own platform, but this is getting a little crazy. The extra fee wouldn't be so bad if developers could inc…

What the article actually says is: > Not to mention the fact that users have built up libraries of dozens of applications and DRM-laden content that won’t transfer between devices. What you say is (emphasis added): > The article makes another great point about people not being able to leave iOS devices for a competitor because all their music , movies, apps, etc are in Apple's DRM format and won't transfer to other d…

I get what you mean, but it still locks you into Apple's devices. Also, Amazon is able to produce content without DRM. Mp3 format music, etc.

Re: Why are you people defending Apple?

#53

Post by adam_albrecht »

rauljara wrote: post #41

If the basic argument is that apple's margin are too high, I agree completely. They are a massively profitable company; they don't need to be charging what they're charging. If the argument is that there is something immoral about them charging people for use of their subscription service, I call bullshit. Until incredibly recently, they had no subscription service. Now they are offering the _option_ to use a subscri…

From what I can tell, there is no option - any type of outside subscription or content that can be accessed through an iOS app must also be offered as an app store subscription or in-app purchase (with the 30% cut). This means that books on the Kindle app, subscriptions through Rdio or Rhapsody, and many other low-margin products and services will be subjected to Apple's ridiculous 30% take.

Re: Why are you people defending Apple?

#54

Post by whatusername »

rauljara wrote: post #41

If the basic argument is that apple's margin are too high, I agree completely. They are a massively profitable company; they don't need to be charging what they're charging. If the argument is that there is something immoral about them charging people for use of their subscription service, I call bullshit. Until incredibly recently, they had no subscription service. Now they are offering the _option_ to use a subscri…

To me the issue is the fact that if you have any form of subscription service -- then you MUST use the IOS service and you MUST pay apple their 30%.

Apple's service looks worthwhile and valid for certain use cases. But to insist that it must be used for any IOS Native app that has a monthly fee is a draconian change.

Reasonably Serious Case: I've been looking at building an app for my wife to offer to her fitness bootcamp clients.. By my understanding of the new rules - I need to allow people to sign-up / renew contracts from within the app. And give Apple 30% of the $200 or so fee.

Re: Why are you people defending Apple?

#55

Post by zyb09 »

chc wrote: post #19
neutronicus wrote: post #6

"And finally, there’s the related notion that anyone who doesn’t like Apple’s rules can pick up and move to another platform, like Android. Which is ridiculous." What? Ridiculous how? This claim is ridiculous. Suck it up and use Android. You'll live. I did.

Abandoning your users and moving to a platform where there's little money to be made is a questionable proposition for producers. And a lot of users will have second thoughts about moving to a platform they perceive to be distinctly inferior just because Apple are being dicks. Also, as a reminder in case you live in a country where it isn't so: Contracts prevent most of Apple's customers from jumping platforms, and s…

Oh that's gonna change, no doubt. Produces can't ignore iOS, true, they'll suck it up for now, but the mobile market isn't gonna stay this way forever if Apple continues to behave this way.

I say 80% of all apps we do, we do now both for iOS and Android. While Android used to be a second class citizen a year or so ago - often just recieving a 'port' of the iPhone version (ok it runs, we're done) - now there's much more focus on making 'native' Android apps (no more Back-button in the navigation bar etc.). Android revenue is still behind iOS, but it's profitable and worth doing.

Since Android is growing already at a much faster rate than iOS and the whole tablet & smartphone business is only expected to get bigger anyway, you gotta wonder where we'll be in say - 5 years from now? Which will be the next Windows, the OS with 90% market share, that everybody is gonna develop for? Well it could've been iOS, but I don't think that's going to happen anymore.

Re: Why are you people defending Apple?

#56

Post by statictype »

rauljara wrote: post #41

If the basic argument is that apple's margin are too high, I agree completely. They are a massively profitable company; they don't need to be charging what they're charging. If the argument is that there is something immoral about them charging people for use of their subscription service, I call bullshit. Until incredibly recently, they had no subscription service. Now they are offering the _option_ to use a subscri…

Now they are offering the _option_ to use a subscription service.

Wrong. Please don't misunderstand this new policy as something that is in addition to the existing rules.

The Kindle App currently in the app store (which doesn't offer in-app purchase or subscription) is now probably in violation of the app store guidelines in light of these new terms. They have forced companies that offer any subscription service outside the store to also offer it in the store and with a hefty 30% commission.

Re: Why are you people defending Apple?

#57

Post by statictype »

lotusleaf1987 wrote: post #16

Zach said it best yesterday: http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=2224469 Of course Rhapsody can't sell their stuff for a 30% margin. It's not their own stuff! They're trying to be the last link in a chain of 90/10 (or more) splits. They repackage record labels' repackaging of artists' content. Do you think the artists would find 30% economically untenable? The App Store is 70/30 because Apple can take things straight…

The App Store is 70/30 because Apple can take things straight from content producer to customer. When the Apple takes the place of publishing, distribution, inventory, sales, payments and shipping, there's real value for that 30%.

This was already addressed in the article. iBooks has a significantly smaller variety of books than Amazon. By becoming the sole gatekeeper for content, Apple is ruling out larger distributers. Users don't gain from this. Only Apple.

Re: Why are you people defending Apple?

#58

Post by chc »

drivebyacct2 wrote: post #32
chc wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Abandoning your users and moving to a platform where there's little money to be made is a questionable proposition for producers. And a lot of users will have second thoughts about moving to a platform they perceive to be distinctly inferior just because Apple are being dicks. Also, as a reminder in case you live in a country where it isn't so: Contracts prevent most of Apple's customers from jumping platforms, and s…

>there's no money to be made Man, I can't read this thread. There is so much hyperbole. I should have recognized the type of people this headline and article would bring out. edit: I don't understand your claim. Your wording wasn't problematic. As I read it before and read it now, you're implying that moving to Android results in "little money to be made". That's the part that I don't really understand I guess.

In response to your edit:

My understanding from every report I have ever read is that there just isn't a lot of money in Android apps. Not a lot of developers share, but those who do tend to report underwhelming results compared to what I see from iOS shops (and those who develop for both platforms have said exactly that in no uncertain terms). For example, Kreci posts his profits every month, and the monthly average is something like $1300 from 10 apps, several of which are pretty popular. All the news stories I see about the Android Market seem to agree with this. If you have better information, I would honestly be fascinated to hear.

(I don't mean to impugn Kreci's success. He's well within the range he wants to be in for where he lives and I'm nothing but happy for him — but for where I live, that's rent on a cheap apartment.)

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