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Educated Fools

newrepublic.com

171–180 of 281 posts

Re: Educated Fools

#171

Great article that exposes many college-educated blind spots, in particular that education is not a panacea for inequality. But the proposed solution of more democratic workplaces — somehow convincing capital-holders that investing in human labor rather than automation is in their own self-interest — feels like swimming against the tide of history. Meritocracy is a dangerous ideal for humanity to continue to hold so…

What is the IQ score of the best current AI and what is the rate of increase?

Re: Educated Fools

#172

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't understand this predilection for believing that other people can't have genuinely held beliefs and values that are vastly different from our own. I hope we can one day come to understand that it's complete lunacy for Mobile Alabama to force Los Angeles to live by its cultural values or vice versa. But today is apparently not that day.

I never argued that the people themselves don't genuinely hold different beliefs about gun rights, abortion, religion, LGBT, etc. I meant two things: 1. in terms of their effect on peoples' lives, these issues pale in comparison to certain other ones AND 2. Republican politicians are using these highly emotionally-charged social issues to induce people to vote against their own interests on dimensions of governance t…

What makes you think you have any insight into what is in their best interest, which of their interests should be most important to them, or how they should measure their quality of life?

Re: Educated Fools

#173

I totally agree with the article, but to me the saddest part of all of this is I'm unconvinced that a college education is actually even that useful. (I say that with a four year CS degree). Most majors, to be blunt, are pretty useless in terms of real world skills. The argument is "they teach you how to think". I don't know how you would even measure that, but it doesn't seem that true, especially since colleges are…

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Re: Educated Fools

#174

I read this and can't help but think that the real fools are the ones buying into the elitism narrative that the far-right has been peddling for years. It's a deliberate red herring exploiting the very human tendency to chafe at any perceived condescension. If people in the US primarily voted the issues (that matter and affect them) instead of on the basis of nonsense, Democrats would win by a landslide. Republican p…

> If people in the US primarily voted the issues (that matter and affect them) instead of on the basis of nonsense, Democrats would win by a landslide. You can't help see the right as wrong because you can't even manage to represent their opinions in any kind of fair light.

I believe the Republican Party is exploiting voters by fomenting outsized hysteria around certain social issues and that this is a smokescreen for a much more insidious agenda to benefit the very few at the expense of the many. I believe the people falling for it are, collectively, fools.

The transgender bathroom debate. The Starbucks holiday coffee cups. There's a fantastic scene in 'Vice' depicting Republican strategists conceiving the 'Death Tax' line against a live test group. These are all variations on a theme of weaponizing emotions and biases to mislead.

In my opinion, if you don't see the elements of carefully-crafted mass behavioral manipulation and you don't see WHY they're doing it, you're just not looking hard enough or you simply don't want to know.

There are conservative positions that I believe have merit. I think that many social issues have remained unresolved for many decades because there are no perfect solutions to them.

The political construct that is the Republican Party, however, is a destructive force tearing at the fabric of our society.

That is my opinion.

Re: Educated Fools

#175

I totally agree with the article, but to me the saddest part of all of this is I'm unconvinced that a college education is actually even that useful. (I say that with a four year CS degree). Most majors, to be blunt, are pretty useless in terms of real world skills. The argument is "they teach you how to think". I don't know how you would even measure that, but it doesn't seem that true, especially since colleges are…

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Re: Educated Fools

#176
post #20

as Chinese lives in uk, they had been my questions for a long time: why did you guys voted for david cameron, barack obama, (any politician, really) at all? had they ever struggled to pay their bills? do they really feel your pain?

There are a lot of comments that are based on the idea that people vote rationally, but I'll describe what I saw.

The federal government has very little influence on how people live their daily lives. Because many people no longer believe that elections matter, they're more than happy to vote for the most entertaining candidate.

Re: Educated Fools

#177
post #52

I totally agree with the article, but to me the saddest part of all of this is I'm unconvinced that a college education is actually even that useful. (I say that with a four year CS degree). Most majors, to be blunt, are pretty useless in terms of real world skills. The argument is "they teach you how to think". I don't know how you would even measure that, but it doesn't seem that true, especially since colleges are…

I'm a university professor in CS. I don't teach people how to problem-solve, and I have never known what other people are talking about when they claim they teach that in their courses. I teach fundamental skills, and then I put my students in front of lots of problems. In an ideal world, they transfer that experience to new problems. My most important role is providing the motivation and structure to go tackle assig…

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Re: Educated Fools

#178

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I never argued that the people themselves don't genuinely hold different beliefs about gun rights, abortion, religion, LGBT, etc. I meant two things: 1. in terms of their effect on peoples' lives, these issues pale in comparison to certain other ones AND 2. Republican politicians are using these highly emotionally-charged social issues to induce people to vote against their own interests on dimensions of governance t…

What makes you think you have any insight into what is in their best interest, which of their interests should be most important to them, or how they should measure their quality of life?

If you don't have cost-effective access to good healthcare, you could literally die. And if you're poorly educated, you're much more likely to be less financially well off and that could itself lead to all kinds of suffering.

But I get the sense that you're aiming for the presentation of being objectively insightful when really you're quite transparently arguing in bad faith for the sake of provocation, so I'll just leave it at that.

Re: Educated Fools

#179
post #170
post #149

In Germany, like most places where 'University is free' - they generally have strict rules on the numbers that can attend, so those with proper Uni degrees hover around 25%. (FYI in America and Canada 'post secondary' can mean something broader). But they have something called 'Mittelstand' or middle industry - vast numbers of mid-sized firms that employ zillions of people, in particular, the take take in apprentices…

Germany also has an issue with its small and medium size enterprises being increasingly outcompeted, relatively weak demography, and a rural to urban hallowing that somewhat mirrors are what is taking place in China and in the states. I don't want to make this argument, but I get the impression that the German economy looks somewhat similar to the American economy in the 60s and 70s, but has managed to persist longer…

Yes that's a fair point. But Germany still make a lot of machinery and equipment that the rest of the world really needs, moreover, they supply their own auto industry.

Thinking creatively, perhaps there's an opportunity to point the apprentice systems towards 'white collar skills' as much as anything else. Lab workers are apparently in high demand.

Re: Educated Fools

#180

Funny how being credentialed by a proper institution (using this phrase because it is more precise than just "education") is as important as ever for achieving certain social standing and at the same time there is a constant stream of voices preaching "universities are imploding, college is a waste of money," etc.

The problem is that a certain social standing is only attainable by a limited number of people. While college may be necessary to get to that social standing, not everyone will be able to get there, even if they go to college.

If your only reason for going to college is to try and attain that certain social standing, and you fall short, then it truly was a waste of money (and, more importantly, time). Colleges do have a struggle to convince those people of their relevance.

A similar phenomena has been seen in incomes. Incomes have held stagnant for decades, even as more and more of the population have become credentialed. Maybe a degree is necessary to reach the top 1%, but those who fall short of that goal are no better off than people were in the past, when they didn't go to college.

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